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Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 11:56:55 AM
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Psalms274
Posts: 1373
Joined: 8/13/2005
From: Georgia
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I was reading a thread in the relationship section which prompted a question for y'all. The thread was "Why do women date and marry jerks?
On of the responses was a lady who told about how the fellow she dated was very kind to her. Apparently he only revealed the good side to her. It turned out that those who knew him best knew he was actually a "jerk" but never told her. When they married she found out the truth about him.
So my questions ... which will deal with various levels of hypothetical relationships to the parties in question ... are:
If you had an acquaintance who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from an acquaintance?
If you had a close friend/family member who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from a close friend/family member?
And now the trickiest question .... same scenarios above, but you have been the only one that has ever seen that behavior ... no one else has ever mentioned it to your knowledge ... Would you react the same way as you stated above?
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 12:15:05 PM
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.Pammy
Posts: 3951
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: PA, USA
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quote:
If you had an acquaintance who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
No, I'd leave it for close friends or family and stay out of it.
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from an acquaintance?
Mmm, actually, I might. Yes, I know this doesn't jibe with my answer to the first question but this is my knee-jerk response. I'm complicated. 
quote:
If you had a close friend/family member who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
Absolutely! It's my duty!
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from a close friend/family member?
Most definitely! I would want it and solicit it!
quote:
And now the trickiest question .... same scenarios above, but you have been the only one that has ever seen that behavior ... no one else has ever mentioned it to your knowledge ... Would you react the same way as you stated above?
You know, Karen, I'm not sure I understand what you mean here. How is this different from the above scenarios?
_____________________________
Pam
"Sweet-talkers win at singles' bars and in politics ... often with similar outcomes for the listener."
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 12:22:01 PM
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Psalms274
Posts: 1373
Joined: 8/13/2005
From: Georgia
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quote:
You know, Karen, I'm not sure I understand what you mean here. How is this different from the above scenarios?
I guess I am thinking of a situation where everyone seems to think an individual is wonderful, yet you have experienced something contrary to their experiences with that individual. The other scenarios assume that you are not the only one who has seen the "obvious."
For me ... my answers for the first four would be yes I would say something after much prayer ... and would prayerfully listen to any input. As to the last one, I am more reluctant to say anything because I realize I may not have the whole story ... though I would have a lingering, "maybe I should say something just to make sure" in the back of my head. I would always prayerfully receive anything someone has to say to me.
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 12:28:38 PM
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.Pammy
Posts: 3951
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: PA, USA
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Psalms274
quote:
You know, Karen, I'm not sure I understand what you mean here. How is this different from the above scenarios?
I guess I am thinking of a situation where everyone seems to think an individual is wonderful, yet you have experienced something contrary to their experiences with that individual. The other scenarios assume that you are not the only one who has seen the "obvious."
For me ... my answers for the first four would be yes I would say something after much prayer ... and would prayerfully listen to any input. As to the last one, I am more reluctant to say anything because I realize I may not have the whole story ... though I would have a lingering, "maybe I should say something just to make sure" in the back of my head. I would always prayerfully receive anything someone has to say to me.
Okay, for that last one then, I believe I agree with you. Especially as the relationship wore on, it would always "niggle" in the back of my mind.
_____________________________
Pam
"Sweet-talkers win at singles' bars and in politics ... often with similar outcomes for the listener."
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 1:10:46 PM
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Pauley464
Posts: 526
Joined: 7/29/2007
From: Washington, Indiana
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Psalms274
I was reading a thread in the relationship section which prompted a question for y'all. The thread was "Why do women date and marry jerks?
On of the responses was a lady who told about how the fellow she dated was very kind to her. Apparently he only revealed the good side to her. It turned out that those who knew him best knew he was actually a "jerk" but never told her. When they married she found out the truth about him.
So my questions ... which will deal with various levels of hypothetical relationships to the parties in question ... are:
If you had an acquaintance who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from an acquaintance?
If you had a close friend/family member who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from a close friend/family member?
And now the trickiest question .... same scenarios above, but you have been the only one that has ever seen that behavior ... no one else has ever mentioned it to your knowledge ... Would you react the same way as you stated above?
While in college, my younger sister was in a relationship with a man who thought he had landed a girl with a rich widow for a mother....I tried to tell her what he was really like, she got enraged and accused me of lying. I went to my older sister, thinking that she would have some influence with our younger sister, she was equally enraged and told me it was none of my business. I went to my mother hoping she would listen to what I had to say. Her reaction was just like that of both my sisters, saying that I didn't know what I was talking about. Both my sisters and my mother had fallen under the spell of this unsrupulous charmer. But after several months of dating, the guy accidentally let something slip in front of my mother and older sister and they figured out what this man was really after. (Namely my fathers post office pension.) When my younger sister finally figured it out as well, I was asked why I didn't tell them about him since I knew him from college.
When I was looking out for my sisters well-being I was accused of being a liar and other horrible things and when they found out I was right they accused of not getting involved to protect her and to this day, my mother is the only one who will admit I was right.
I will never again get involved in something of that nature. They won't believe you nor welcome your input no matter what your intentions are.
_____________________________
There is nothing so important that it can't be put off until tomorrow.
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 2:11:31 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8009
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Psalms274
If you had an acquaintance who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
Greatly depends on the level of acquaintance and how well I knew the jerk. If I knew the bad person well enough to be sure of their misbehavior I'd probably find a way to get the message across. Perhaps talking to a friend of my acquaintance who was closer to them than I was.
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from an acquaintance?
If the behavior was provable, definitely. (If the behavior was not provable see question 5)
quote:
If you had a close friend/family member who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
I'd be standng on my chair shouting it out to them. Of course they probably wouldn't listen (if the past is any predicter of the future) But my family/friend duty demands that I at least try to inform them.
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from a close friend/family member?
Yes. But the odds are very strong that I wouldn't be in a relationship with someone who behaved like a jerk anyway. I tend to be somewhat cautious on the front end and ask questions about such things. If there's a doubt I don't ask out.
quote:
And now the trickiest question .... same scenarios above, but you have been the only one that has ever seen that behavior ... no one else has ever mentioned it to your knowledge ... Would you react the same way as you stated above?
I have to tell. Duty demands it. Even if I lose the friend or am shunned by the family member. If I am the recipient I would take it into account and pray about it and investigate it. (Depending of course on the reputation of the one who told me. If they had been known to lie I probably wouldn't trust them anyway)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 2:25:54 PM
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gaylel1
Posts: 1245
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southern California, the land of Fruit and nuts...
Status: offline
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quote:
I was reading a thread in the relationship section which prompted a question for y'all. The thread was "Why do women date and marry jerks?
On of the responses was a lady who told about how the fellow she dated was very kind to her. Apparently he only revealed the good side to her. It turned out that those who knew him best knew he was actually a "jerk" but never told her. When they married she found out the truth about him.
So my questions ... which will deal with various levels of hypothetical relationships to the parties in question ... are:
quote:
If you had an acquaintance who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
Yes, I would. In fact, I would bring it to the attention of the person and address my concerns. I know the bible says that we should not judge and well we should'nt, however when someone is in a relationship and especially when the person's life in in danger, I'll let them know.
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from an acquaintance?
Sure I will....
quote:
If you had a close friend/family member who was in the early stages of a relationship with someone with questionable behavior (based on your personal observations) would you say something?
Yes I would, but if it up to the person to take the advice. Some people think that "Love is Blind" and they find out when they know that this indivisual is not cut out like he supposed to be. We women are weak in that area until it is too late.
quote:
If you were the person who was in the relationship, would you welcome the input from a close friend/family member?
Yes I would. And I evem welcome the input from my pastor as well.
quote:
And now the trickiest question .... same scenarios above, but you have been the only one that has ever seen that behavior ... no one else has ever mentioned it to your knowledge ... Would you react the same way as you stated above?
Yes I would, and I will back away from the relationship, if the relationship I thought would endanger my life or either feeling that I was decivced because of several issues he had.
_____________________________
Hear "The Truth" with the "other"l Jeff Johnson(http://www.calvarydowney.org)
Visit me at http:www.gayleplace.blogspot.com or http://www.myspace.com/gaylel121
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 4:26:20 PM
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ladioffaith
Posts: 2995
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: NE Ohio (L.A. . . Lower Akron)
Status: offline
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Sometimes, people won't believe the truth even if you say it to their face.
Other times, people see something negative in a person just because they resent the change the new relationship brings to their friendship.
So I think my FIRST course of action would be to pray that God opens the person's eyes to the truth, no matter how much it may hurt.
_____________________________
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save.
He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with
his love, he will rejoice over you with singing." Zeph. 3:17
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 5:02:23 PM
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Psalms274
Posts: 1373
Joined: 8/13/2005
From: Georgia
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ladioffaith
Sometimes, people won't believe the truth even if you say it to their face.
Other times, people see something negative in a person just because they resent the change the new relationship brings to their friendship.
So I think my FIRST course of action would be to pray that God opens the person's eyes to the truth, no matter how much it may hurt.
I think we can sometimes see things in a negative light when we have had a negative experience with the person in question, and need to be VERY discerning on how to share IF you do share because of that experience.
Our own perceptions of something that "must be shared" may not be accurate and both the one sharing and the one receiving need to approach this type of discussion from a heart in line with the Father's heart.
_____________________________
I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ.
< Linus w/ a friends baby!
http://piswa.blogspot.com/
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 5:55:44 PM
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ShallbeRebuilt
Posts: 2104
Joined: 11/8/2007
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If as stated in the OP you have personally observed these behaviors, then your scriptural mandate is to go and confront the jerk personally..not spread stuff to his/her SO. This eliminates completely any concern about whether the person you fear will be harmed is acquaintance or friend/family, and also eliminates the last scenario completely.
Being a jerk is sinful behavior. Going to the jerk in meekness, humility, grace, and LOVE and confronting the behavior so that he/she has a chance to repent and change is the process outlined in scripture.
If the jerk doesn't change (and one evidence of true change that I would insist upon would be for the jerk to come clean to the SO about his/her behavior) then I would have the right to go to a church leader and ask that they go with me to confront the behavior. If that does not result in true repentance, at that point I would have every right and even the duty to go to the SO, whether acquaintance or family member, and explain the problem and what I've done to attempt to rectify it as according to scripture.
Then that person may do whatever they like. Believe me or not, act on the information or not. I've done what God expects of me.
Obviously you cannot do this if it would put you in physical danger. If that is the case, then your only option would be to take it to church leadership. If that is not possible, then depending on the severity of the issue, you may need to visit with a law-enforcement professional.
I used to attend church where the pastor displayed his very sick manipulative behavior only for a very few whom he felt to be a threat to him. I was one of them. I confronted him. He pretended not to have this problem. I didn't have to go to a church leader, because a church leader approached me and asked if I had experienced it. The church leaders confronted him. No repentance.
Because of this person's skill at manipulating and hiding it, those church leaders who confronted him and those of us who had been victims of his manipulation eventually had to leave--very few believed us when we pointed out the evidence. I still have friends who go to that church...we don't talk about church nor him as pastor, because they have all flat out told me that they don't want to know.
Go figure.
Anyway, that's what I believe scripture says about how to handle a situation as described in the OP. Not all such things are as clear cut, but I believe in this example it is quite definitive.
besiderself
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/29/2008 11:04:45 PM
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John_O
Posts: 8009
Joined: 9/5/2006
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Thanks Besiderself!
Matt 18: 15 ¶ Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
So in the OP has the brother trespassed against you or is he a danger against them? I feel that we are allowed to warn others of approaching danger. Should we talk to the danger? Probably. But we also can't him go around hurting people if we can prevent it.
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Would you wish to know? - 7/30/2008 3:16:39 AM
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ebony101
Posts: 934
Joined: 4/1/2007
From: the big blue marble
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I think that we should feel an obligation to let the person know what you know about the individual under question. However, it is up to them what they do with the information that you have given them.
I would like to add that I don't know what I would do in a situation like those described. I do know that it is very difficult to tell a person negative things about an individual whom they adore and with whom they may be romantically involved. It takes a lot of nerve and courage to do your Christian obligation in such a situation.
Dependent on the intensity of the relationship your friend will most likely ignore you or be very slow to act on the information gained. They may need to experience proof of the aberrant behaviour. Or they may need additional friends to warn them that the individual is not all that he/she appears to be.
_____________________________
'We're writing a gospel, a chapter each day,
By the things that we do & the words that we say.'
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