RE: DH and I are butting heads (Full Version)

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PatricksPeaches -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 10:06:19 PM)

Great advice!! Thank you!!! We are taking a break from biblical counseling for the summer but will pick back up in September. If this isn't resolved rationally by then, I will bring it up there.



cynthia -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 10:53:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PatricksPeaches

Great advice!! Thank you!!! We are taking a break from biblical counseling for the summer but will pick back up in September. If this isn't resolved rationally by then, I will bring it up there.

Very good. Be patient. He is a grown man who is perfectly capable of doing the right thing. Build him up in truth. When you set a firm boundary, it is very important to also build and speak life into both your husband and the relationship.



JuliaHop -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 11:09:35 PM)

Okay, as an outsider who can only read one side of the discussion between you and your husband, I would be very hesitant to automatically assume that your husband is unreasonable when I look at the information presented in your posts.

quote:

We are at 130 right now. So we will have hopefully around 170 days for second grade by the end of August. I think that is about right and average for even public schools.


I will not be quick to jump to your defense (or your husbands) since I can only read one side of the argument in this thread.

I will speak as an outsider looking at the information you have posted:

1) There have been approx. 320 calendar days since the start of September.

2) That is 45.71 weeks. 45.71 weeks x 5 days per week = 228 possible school days if you were looking at a traditional schedule (I could just look at the 320 days).

3) You have completed approx. 130 days of your chosen curriculum, so you have used your curriculum approx. 2.84 days per week (if you picked up the pace this summer, you may have used your chosen curriculum even less than that).

4) Your goal is to finish another 40 days in the last 42 days before the end of August.

That will put a lot of pressure on your family. It can be done, but, perhaps it is already causing pressure if you are having to sacrifice all of your families time in order to get caught up with your lessons.

It can be very difficult to priortize when we are trying to meet the needs of our families (there are so many things that can grab our attention). I am wondering if you have been trying to "catch up" all summer and your husband is very frustrated that there is no true relaxation time (time without the responsibility of completing school) this summer. The warm weather is not long lived in Michigan and when you are finished for the year, summer will be gone.

Perhaps this next year you should consider coming up with a semi-fixed schedule for completion of your academics. This might help you to stay on task and meet the goals that you have set with your curriculum...and keep you from having to race to the finish at the end of the summer.

I am sure that most homeschoolers fall behind at some point (some years are definitely better than others), but, I would work towards priortizing your activities so that your life is a lot less hectic and frightening when the days seem to be flying by.

This might help bring peace into your home.

Prayer is also a very important part of being a homeschool parent.



Jenny-Fair -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 11:14:10 PM)

quote:

I want to point something else out. The problem isn't that the man doesn't understand homeschooling. The problem is that he refuses to listen and is provoking and frustrating his wife. If he had listening and read the information and sought to understand, but disagreed, then that is an entirely different matter. The problem here is that he is demanding his own way, but he refuses to listen to his wife and even discuss the matter. This is indicative of deeper issues in the marriage that need to be addressed. Setting appropriate boundaries is imperative to working through the issues.

Cynthia nailed it.



cindybode -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 11:28:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair

quote:

I want to point something else out. The problem isn't that the man doesn't understand homeschooling. The problem is that he refuses to listen and is provoking and frustrating his wife. If he had listening and read the information and sought to understand, but disagreed, then that is an entirely different matter. The problem here is that he is demanding his own way, but he refuses to listen to his wife and even discuss the matter. This is indicative of deeper issues in the marriage that need to be addressed. Setting appropriate boundaries is imperative to working through the issues.

Cynthia nailed it.


Yep, she did.

I have lived with a similar situation since we began homeschooling - which was 17 years ago, btw. I did everything I could think of to get my dh interested and involved, with no results. And yet every June, when I'm putting portfolios together (which he refuses to help with), he angrily informs me that "these kids haven't done anything all year" and that I won't possibly be able to come up with anything to put in the portfolios.

I interrupt him mid sentence, let him know that since he has refused to be involved at all duing the year his opinion is not welcome now, and keep on doin' what I'm doin'. He is well aware that anytime he'd like to have some actual constructive input into what we're doing, I am more than willing to discuss it, but I refuse to allow him to treat me or the children in this manner. He is provoking me to anger, and he is making his children feel as if everything they've learned counts for nothing. I'm simply not putting up with it.



JuliaHop -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 11:50:13 PM)

quote:

quote:

I want to point something else out. The problem isn't that the man doesn't understand homeschooling. The problem is that he refuses to listen and is provoking and frustrating his wife. If he had listening and read the information and sought to understand, but disagreed, then that is an entirely different matter. The problem here is that he is demanding his own way, but he refuses to listen to his wife and even discuss the matter. This is indicative of deeper issues in the marriage that need to be addressed. Setting appropriate boundaries is imperative to working through the issues.


And I will note that we don't know this to be true in this familiies situation. The husband could just be disgusted with the whole thing and is tired of excuses as to why they are doing school work so that their child is prepared for third grade by September. Or this mom may have been doing an excellent job and her child is academically excelling and the father just doesn't care.

We don't know.



Jenny-Fair -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/16/2008 11:52:23 PM)

Aren't the kids tested?



PatricksPeaches -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 12:02:19 AM)

No she isn't. At least not by our state. Like I said before, Michigan doesn't have any requirements for home schooling. If I wanted her tested I could do it myself but haven't done it yet.



Jenny-Fair -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 12:05:49 AM)

That might be part of a good compromise.



PatricksPeaches -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 12:15:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jenny-Fair

That might be part of a good compromise.

Very true, never thought of that!! Thank you!!



cynthia -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 12:30:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JuliaHop
And I will note that we don't know this to be true in this familiies situation. The husband could just be disgusted with the whole thing and is tired of excuses as to why they are doing school work so that their child is prepared for third grade by September. Or this mom may have been doing an excellent job and her child is academically excelling and the father just doesn't care.

We don't know.

My advise is based on the information as it is presented. That's what forums is about.



Sunnymom -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 7:49:33 AM)

Part of homeschooling is deschooling. Until that takes place, there will be continual misunderstandings.

My dh used to ask me all the time what grade the kids were in, and I drove him nuts (in a good way) saying things like "What grade would you like them to be in?" or "We were feeling very 6th grade today".[8D] It took three years for him to finally GET IT, that grades are simply how schools are organized, and that they don't mean anything. The word 'behind' means nothing- behind what? When I was in 4th grade doing 8th grade work, what did that mean? Was the entire school behind me? Was I ahead of them? Why didn't they send me to the local jr. high, and instead put me in the school library with a stack of books and let me teach myself?

Because- the schools are organized in a certain way, and promotion based on mastery is simply is not done. Any system so obtuse as that needs to be fed to a garbage disposal and rebuilt from the termites up. But I digress.[:D]

Buckle up for the long haul. Homeschooling concepts are foreign to an institutionalized mind, and it takes time to deprogram. I would make as many compromises as I could to satisfy your dh, and with a sweet spirit. He will probably eventually come around, especially if he sees that you are willing to meet him halfway. His apparent disinterest and stubbornness is troubling, but he may perceive you as being stubborn as well. Men are weird.[8D][8D][8D]



Consecrated2God -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 8:24:11 AM)

quote:

Maybe your Dh wants you to homeschool while he is at work.
Does he work days by any chance? If so, maybe he figures that is a good time for you to homeschool so that there can be time for him when he gets home. That's just my 2 cents.


That was my thought, too. I know you said he goes to work at 11:00 (with an hour commute--so he would leave at 10:00, yes?) and that he thinks school should be started at 9:00. I'm just trying to picture what it is that he wants to see.

Here's my guess, based on what you've said, that he would like to see. Let me know if you think this is close. He would like to see them get started at school before he leaves for work, so he can have good feelings during the day that his kids are being educated. When he gets home, he'd like for it to be all wrapped up, the books put away, the house picked up, and supper on the table. He'd like to know when school will be out during the summer so you can all have a normal family vacation time.

As it is, since school is still going on when he gets home, he is thinking, "If they had started at a decent time they'd be done right now". Since you are still trying to finish up school from last year in August, he is thinking that if you had been more vigilant, you could have been finished by now.

I think that he's upset because the schooling all year 'round is cutting into the kind of life he'd like to have. I don't think it's so much about the record keeping, because if it was, he'd be interested in seeing the records. I think it's a lifestyle thing.

My 2 cents. [:)]



macokjc -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 11:18:29 AM)

I have thought long and hard about this post, and can only hope my thoughts come out in a clear manner. I totally agree with:
quote:

And I will note that we don't know this to be true in this families situation. The husband could just be disgusted with the whole thing and is tired of excuses as to why they are doing school work so that their child is prepared for third grade by September. Or this mom may have been doing an excellent job and her child is academically excelling and the father just doesn't care.


I am trying to say this carefully and respectfully. I do not think that the original poster was "husband bashing." She was truly explaining her feelings on a forum. However, there have been several accusations labeled against this husband, whom we know nothing about. He is NOT being abusive. There are TWO sides to every story. The husband is the head of the house, period. That does not mean that the wife is a door-mat, and that the husband is allowed to be abusive. It does mean that the wife is to be submissive to the husbands wishes and the husband is to love his wife as himself. This is not an "I will if you will" thing. The wife is still to be submissive even if the husband is not always loving, and it goes both ways. It is not our place to label the husband as "anything" and in the long run I think it does harm to the OP.

For all we know, the husband is sincerely concerned about the manner in which his daughter is learning, maybe there is no evidence of progress - we don't know what he is thinking or feeling. Many people feel that children should have the summer off - I know I love having the summer off. That doesn't mean that all things educational is thrown out the door, but everybody just has a nice break. I know that this is not a popular viewpoint, but no matter what your method, homeschooling is a big responsibility and hard work. It CANNOT be an afterthought to your day. Homeschooling is not the answer for everybody. There are some parents out there that should not be homeschooling. It is not a matter of simply "deprogramming" somebody's mind.

All over this site I have seen a lot of "husband bashing." While we don't always see eye to eye, my husband has just as much a vested interested in our children's growth and development, and I always pay attention to what he has to say in the matter of raising the children. I know that the OP wants what is truly best for her family and her child, and I am confident that with compromises, that will be obtained.



sen10tious -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 12:46:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PatricksPeaches

My DH works from 11A to 6P with an hour drive each way. I do try to get school done while he is at work. Sometimes things get us off track a bit but that is just how it goes some days. I usually start school in the afternoon while the baby is napping and after lunch. That just works best for us. He thinks it should be a 9A to 4P like ps. I don't think he really understands hs. Maybe that is the thing I need to explain.
Thank you all!!!

If he worked a 9-5 job, schooling from 9-4 would be a reasonable request to give him the most family time. Since his work day begins near lunch hour. . . (So he does not understand the logic of starting school after lunch?) . . .I think I will avoid trying to figure that out.

My reaction was similar to JuliaHop's, although I didn't do her detailed calculations. I just mentally thought "40 days before the end of August? Yikes!"

In the first post you said your husband "thinks that it should be done at a regular time and schedule." Based on your 40 days before the end of August, it looks like he has a good point. If having a regular time is what it takes to get him 'on board' with home schooling, then get a regular schedule—at least for your core classes such as math and reading.

Personally, I found a year to be too long to manage well; and that was particularly true during the years the kids were young and busy with grade school level work. I liked to divide the year into three trimesters. It was much easier to keep four months in order than twelve. We would aim to have most of the basics covered in two trimesters, split by a Christmas break. The summer trimester was my time to experiment with unschooling and test out if being a free spirit learner could really work.

Over the years of trial and error I found that, for our family, we "delighted" in only about two-thirds of the learning; the rest was work that needed a schedule.

Yep, this is something that you will have to figure out what works best for your family unit, not just best for you or best just for your dh.



shadowspring -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 1:45:44 PM)

quote:

When he gets home, he'd like for it to be all wrapped up, the books put away, the house picked up, and supper on the table.
ROFLOL! [8D][8D][8D][8D]

Do you need to be in a dress with a while frilly apron, high heels and a string of pearls too? [;)]



shadowspring -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 1:51:06 PM)

I though I would add, as well, in the OPs defense on days of bookwork accomplished:

Most of my canned curriculum (Saxon, SOS, Christian Liberty Press) either does not set a fixed number of days for completion, or it is closer to 140 lessons for a school year.

And I will add, that I do not ever remember, not once in my entire 12 year public school student career, any teacher ever completing every lesson in any subject- not one subject and not even close to an entire textbook being covered! Not one time!

My retired public school teacher friend assures me that my memory is accurate. [&:]



PatricksPeaches -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 2:34:14 PM)

Just a few things to clarify:

I chose to school all year long and DH was okay with that. That allowed us to take vacations throughout the year as we saw fit.

The curriculum we are using has actually 170 lessons total. That would be "seat work" but if I added in all the extras we did throughout the year, our actual schooling days would be over the 180. I only wrote down the days we actually did "seat work".

I wasn't "husband bashing". I was just expressing my frustration over a particular situation. I admit that I might have been harsh and I apologize for that.

School is usually done by the time he gets home. On some occasions it hasn't been that way but that was for reasons that couldn't be avoided. Not because of laziness.

I am beginning to think that his problem isn't in the way I home school. I think it is that he doesn't understand the difference between home school and public school. Like I posted earlier, maybe that is what I need to explain to him.

We are both very stubborn. lol But no one else would put up with either of us. We are great when we can agree and kind of dangerous if we don't. LOL But God is great and He has a plan for us.

I do wear only dresses but my DH is the one who should wear the frilly apron. He does the cooking in the house. He loves to cook and chooses to do it. I do the dishes, so it is a compromise that works for us. :) The mental picture of my 6' 1", 300lb husband in a frilly apron is just killing me here. [sm=Llol.gif]
I will try to implement some of your suggestions that I feel are worth trying. Thank you all for replying. I didn't think I would cause such a response. I am not trying to debate issues, just get some healthy advice. Thank you again.



macokjc -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 3:59:17 PM)

quote:

I do wear only dresses but my DH is the one who should wear the frilly apron. He does the cooking in the house. He loves to cook and chooses to do it. I do the dishes, so it is a compromise that works for us. :) The mental picture of my 6' 1", 300lb husband in a frilly apron is just killing me here.


I love your sense of humor! It will help to see you through! [:D]



PrincessDonna -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 6:08:32 PM)

quote:

I am beginning to think that his problem isn't in the way I home school. I think it is that he doesn't understand the difference between home school and public school. Like I posted earlier, maybe that is what I need to explain to him.


That could very well be. I couldn't believe how much we were able to get done, with toddlers and baby underfoot in a short time compared to public school. It generally doesn't even take half the time because it's one on one teaching and you don't have so many time-wasting disruptions as part of the school day.

Also, my son spent most of this last year in Christian school. I don't think they completely finished a SINGLE workbook. When we hsed, we finished all but one! I think we put too much pressure on ourselves sometimes, even as moms, so it would certainly stand to reason that if your husband is not home, seeing how your daughter is doing, it may not look like you're doing enough.

I think testing would be a great idea, even though your state doesn't require it. It would show about where she compares to others her age, and if there are weak spots, they will show up and you can work more on those.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I hope you didn't take my previous comment the wrong way. I just wanted to make the point that your husband is well within normal to want a part of her schooling, even if it's just to be assured that it is being done well. It's his responsibility as much as it is yours, KWIM?



PatricksPeaches -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/17/2008 7:01:18 PM)

quote:


I hope you didn't take my previous comment the wrong way. I just wanted to make the point that your husband is well within normal to want a part of her schooling, even if it's just to be assured that it is being done well. It's his responsibility as much as it is yours, KWIM?[/color]

No hurt feelings here! I appreciate everyone's point of view. I asked for comments and knew I would get a wide variety. That is okay because God made us all to be different.



Shells54 -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/18/2008 7:51:56 AM)

I just wanted to add that me and my hubby had the same problem about getting on the same page. He thought that hs should resemble a ps and when it didn't he said that we weren't getting anything accomplished. What helped us was me sitting him down explaining to him that there were differences in hs then ps I went through all the times when they are getting everyone seated and the standing in line for things. I also explained to him that part of the reason for hsing was that a classroom environment was not working for 2 of the kids so since it didn't work in ps why should i bring it to the hs.



creationtalk -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/18/2008 8:57:07 AM)

quote:

If this were me, I would tell him the following:


* That he is being unloving and demanding and lording it over you. This is unscriptural.
* That his is not honoring you and his prayers may therefore be hindered. (1 Peter 3:7)
* That he is making a decision that is based on feeling rather than on knowledge and understanding. The Bible tells us to get understanding. (Proverbs 4:5-7 and Psalm 119:66)
* According to Proverbs 1:22, his behavior is foolish. He is a scorner of his wife and refuses to get knowledge, but rather asserts his own way in ignorance.
* That husband and wife are to be in unity. 1 Corinthians 11 outline this showing that the husband and wife are one. This passage does not refer to the husband as decision maker, but as the protector and as husband and wife as one. When he makes decisions counter to your knowledge and understanding, he is behaving in a foolish and ungodly manner.


Then I would tell him that I will not discuss this matter further or be treated with scorn. If he wants to discuss it further, it will be with the plan to come to unity, not for him to try to lord it over you and tear you down. It is his duty, as a husband before God to speak to you in a loving and appropriate manner in seeking unity as a couple. If he wants to lord it over you, his prayers will be hindered and he is damaging his relationship with you, your child and with Heavenly Father. You are doing your best to honor him and the Lord and will continue to do so, but will not be treated rudely in the meantime.


While I agree that this is what needs to be communicated, I am concerned that the accusing tone might escalate the situation. I do not know the man in question, but when I pointed out to my xh that some of his behaviors were not Biblical or Christ-like, I very nearly got hit and probably would have if he hadn't had the length of the room to think about it...and was accused of saying he was not a Christian and a lot of other very nasty things.

PP, I'm so feel for you. I have been in a very similar position as you. I have no suggestions beyond refusing to discuss the homeschooling unless he is willing to really search for a solution that works for the family...and pray that God will work on his heart.



JuliaHop -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/18/2008 8:59:23 AM)

quote:

I chose to school all year long and DH was okay with that. That allowed us to take vacations throughout the year as we saw fit.


It is hard to get into the rythm of doing something new...and homeschooling definitely changes the rythm of a household.

Did he understand that you planned to do a lot of your academic work during the summer? Perhaps that is why he is bothered at this time. Perhaps he sees how hard you are working to catch up to your goals and it is frustrating him that you are needing to push yourself so hard.



maverickmom -> RE: DH and I are butting heads (7/18/2008 9:28:41 AM)

I am probably going to anger a slew of people with my responses on this, but God Bless all of you anyway. I am a School Counselor by training, and currently do a great deal of pastoral counseling.


I have many many concerns about home schooling in general. I have home schooled for short periodsof time with three of my four children, but mostly due to their health resons. Keep in mind that I followed the curriculae of each school district I lived in at the time, and also keep in mind I was at least a licensed teacher when I undertook this endeavor. I am interested in the basic fundamental reason why people feel inclined to home school their children. I welcome these responses. I also am willing to act as an advisor or resource if anyone needs there services.



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