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2Preacher -> Waiting on God? (8/21/2008 11:50:06 PM)

Ever wondered why it is so hard to wait on God? I can tell you that it is the most difficult thing I have ever done. I've gone through all of the emotions and thoughts that come to your mind. Anger, questioning, wondering what is going on, you name it I've been there.

I am a minister and have been one for 20 years. I've pastored 2 small churches, gone through 14 years of College and Seminary training, raised my family, and now, at 46 (soon to be 47) years of age - it seems I am stuck? I'm in between churches and it seems that nothing is on the horizon for me. I've been told to go start a church somewhere. I have been told to just keep waiting on God and he will bring me back in his time. I only know that I want to serve and I am tired of feeling like I am spinning my wheels and getting no where.

Does anyone have any advice for me? I feel that God is trying to teach me something, I am just not sure what it is.

2Preacher



MrsDC -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/22/2008 12:39:35 AM)

Have you and your wife been praying about this together?

quote:

I have been told to just keep waiting on God and he will bring me back in his time.


I don't know any history, but this statement implies a turning away on your part. If that is true, have you repented and are you walking in that repentance? Just questions to help me understand where you're coming from.

As I said, I know nothing of your situation, but my first, gut response is a quote from Irwin McManus..."Just do whatever." Phil. 4:8 "Whatever is true, whatever is kind, whatever is noble..." you know the verse. Step out in faith to do the work that you see at your hand to do. How can God direct you if you're not moving? Are you afraid that you will do the wrong good thing? I promise that you won't mess up God's perfect plan by doing a good thing that wasn't "scheduled" for you to do!

BUT my first comment is still the most important: Are you and your wife seeking God's face and agreeing in prayer about this issue daily?

-- Rebecca



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/22/2008 10:35:10 AM)

Rebecca:

quote:

I don't know any history, but this statement implies a turning away on your part. If that is true, have you repented and are you walking in that repentance? Just questions to help me understand where you're coming from.


I was hurt badly at my last position. The situation really wasn't my fault and I don't feel that I really did anything wrong (other than being "human" about it). It definitely was not anything immoral or illegal. However, the way it was handled by those over me (two different pastors) was scripturally wrong.

Lies were told behind my back by one (the first) and the other (his replacement) simply refused to do things the way the Scriptures tell us to in dealing with "problems" between brethren because he didn't think it was necessary. When I confronted the situation from the Scriptures, I was told that "it (the Bible) didn't matter. The Preacher was right and I was wrong."

What hurt me so badly was the fact that not only am I a minister, but these two men were "supposed" to be as well. At least they call themselves that. I have always had a very high regard for the office of pastor and for those who hold it. What these two did completely destroyed that "respect" at least where they were concerned.

Please don't misunderstand. I do believe in pastoral authority. I have been in that position myself on two separate occasions over 13 yrs. I realize that it is a difficult job at best especially when problems arise. I have never said that these two men were wrong for "WHAT" they did. It was the "WAY", the "how", they did it that was wrong. No one, no matter who he is or what position he holds in a church, has the right or authority to side step the Word of God and do his own thing especially when the Word of God contains a prescribed method of dealing with the situation.

I admit that my reaction was not all that it should have been and have confessed this to God and been forgiven. I don't believe that I over reacted or lost my temper. I confronted the issue quietly and in private with both men out of respect for them. One of them, when confronted, acknowledged his wrong grudgingly. The other only got angry with me and acted as though I had no right to confront him with the issue.

That is not the way for a "pastor" to react in my estimation. The lies that were told pretty much destroyed my reputation at the church, at least among the men of the church. Not that "my" reputation is all that important, bu I felt very highly disrespected and hurt that "my pastor" did not care enough for me to come to me and discuss his thoughts and feelings before going to the men of the church.t

Anyway there you have it - the background you requested. This situation happened 4 years ago. I have since attempted to restore the relationship with the first pastor, but he has not made any move toward me. As far as I know the second man is okay with things as they are. Both have moved out of the area so contact is limited.

To give you an idea of how badly I was hurt. I have known the Lord as my Savior for almost 41 years. I can count on my fingers and toes the number of times in my life that I have missed church for any reason other than being sick or out of town. I love the Lord. There is no place I would rather be than in his house with his people. This situation REALLY ROCKED MY WORLD. So much so that, on the evening of the Sunday that the second man, on his own authority threw me out of the church, I told my wife that she and the boys were welcome to go to church, but I would never go back. I realize that sounds more angry than hurt, but a wounded man often says things he wouldn't ordinarily say. I even thought briefly, God forgive me, of ending it all. I know this is wrong, but it hurt me that bad to see everything go up in smoke in what seemed to be an instant of time.

Praise the Lord, that did not happen. My family and I, by God's grace, found another church to attend which is great . We have a pastor who is loving and very conservative in his preaching. I can honestly say that in the 4 years we have been there, there haven't been very many services when I wasn't convicted by the preaching. We love this church.

I have to go for a while. I will respond further later. My wife and I have been praying about this separately. I don't talk to her too much about it. I don't really know why.

2Preacher



4IMPersuaded -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/23/2008 7:36:10 PM)

Hi 2Preacher-- I am so sorry for the hurt you suffered. My church is currently involved in the aftermath of an ugly situation in which one of our staff was asked to resign. Even within the brotherhood, people act humanly and not at all Christ-like.

Please understand that I bear no judgement. In reading your post, though, I am certain that you have claimed forgiveness, but how fully have you forgiven these two pastors who hurt you? They took away your livelihood and your reputation in the church and that is clearly more than one man should bear. Can you say that you have forgiven them despite their apparent unwillingness to seek it? You don't have to answer that here, it is absolutely between you and God.

In answer to your OP... Have you considered writing-- are you journaling? It may sound like a goofy question, but the act of journaling can really bring God's will for your life into sharp focus. It directs thoughts better than simply praying or meditating for many people. It may even tun out that God is calling you to share your journey with others.

You have a tremendous opportunity on your horizon, brother, to proclaim God's glory through how He works in your life. You are on a journey that casts you as the strong oak-- the display of God's splendor (see Isaiah 61:1-4) as you share with others how He he has brought healing in your life.

Yes, waiting on Him is excruciating, but as you know there are different reasons for this. He may be waiting on you to learn something for the next leg of the journey, He may be waiting you someone else to learn something from you, or He may be working behind the scenes to set the stage for the next step He is going to ask you to take. If you are currently "on the bench," though, you know that you have to work out just like the players in the game so that you will be ready when He calls you in.

Blessings as you wait! Keep in prayer and in the Word!



lightshineon -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/23/2008 7:55:04 PM)

Hi, similar to a hurtful situation we are going through. Anger managment is hard, when people who supposedly know the truth, do not live it. The Lord will judge them for that, it is written. I do not understand that people who should do not be in power, be in power/ They lie, and do lie without shame. There are good pastors, and churches though. Ask yourself do you want to sit in authority, or under authority of those who do these things.I will not judge you about forgiveness, it seems you tried restoration, and they do not care about that. Spiritual wounds always make you feel so bad. I will pray for you. Maybe, an oppurtunity will open up tommorow, or next week, He has not forgotten you no more than he did Joseph.



watchman2c -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/24/2008 12:58:24 PM)

Dear 2Preacher: We Christians are very quick to offer our "advice," but I wonder if you are more needing to "vent" than to recieve advice. I know from my own experience that being in limbo and waiting on God can be unsettling. I've been through some potentially very devestating situations...may I share what I have learned. 1. God never abandons us and He is always totally aware of our situation. That means that whatever we are going through He is not only aware but for purposes only He knows He maintains His distance. 2. I've learned not to fret or dwell on my trials but rather to keep myself busy with family, friends..create your own ministry opportunities, find a job...keep productive! 3. God has never failed me. He always answers me...in His time and according to His will...but He has never failed to show me the way, teach me a lesson so that I may grow up, reveal His will, etc. I have learned that He nevers fails me...any failure is of my own creation. 4. Hang out with those few men and women of true faith. The church is full of religious people but seek out those who have demonstrated true faith. 5. Don't neglect your wife and family. Stand strong for them. 6. Keep the faith. God will honor your for it. In case you are wondering I am a missionary in Uganda, East Africa, saved at age 51 and former assoc. pastor 1995-2004! God bless you in mighty and unexpected ways! Rev Alan



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/24/2008 9:25:10 PM)

To all:

Thanks for the helpful advice. My experience has taught me many things. I am still dealing with some issues caused by the problem - mainly discouragement.

God has helped me by giving me opportunities along the way to minister in a variety of ways. I sing in the choir at church, substitute for different Sunday School classes and preach on occasion at our new church when the pastor asks me to . I am also engaged in a ministry at a local nursing home three Sundays a month.

The Lord has blessed this ministry. I have seen four precious senior citizens come to Christ. All of them past the age of 70. The oldest was 93 and a life long Catholic. Three of them passed away not long after accepting the Lord. The last was an 81 year old man who accepted Christ on Father's day.

I have enjoyed this work for the Lord. Sometimes it is difficult because of the age of the people. I get attached to them and then they pass away. It is difficult to say good bye. All of them are very special to my heart.

This ministry eases the pain of my experience. It gives me a release for my pastoral passion. God is blessing it inspite of my ineptness. Sometimes I feel guilty about going because it makes me feel so good to go and minister. Other times I go when I feel down and discouraged, but I always leave feeling that I have been given a bigger blessing than I gave. Sometimes it seems that I go just for the "lift" I get from it.

quote:

In reading your post, though, I am certain that you have claimed forgiveness, but how fully have you forgiven these two pastors who hurt you? They took away your livelihood and your reputation in the church and that is clearly more than one man should bear. Can you say that you have forgiven them despite their apparent unwillingness to seek it? You don't have to answer that here, it is absolutely between you and God.



4IMpersuaded:

I have honestly tried to forgive and to forget. The problem is that I can't seem to "forget". I am constantly reminded of it . Everything around me, especially in church, reminds me of it. I see my Pastor in the pulpit on Sunday and I wonder why I am not preaching somewhere. I teach Sunday School and I wonder why I am not allowed to do it all the time. I see others ministering and I feel that I should be doing it as well. It is very difficult even with the opportunities I have to just sit sometimes.

I know that I am called to pastor. That is what I feel I should be doing. Someone told me once, "if you can do anything else and be happy, don't preach." My answer to that is "I can't". I am not happy doing anything else and it is hard to sit by and wait because of it.

Gotta go for now. Write more later. God knows my heart. He knows where I want to be. I just don't know anymore where he wants me to be.

2Preacher



jn1010lf -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 5:58:39 PM)

Hello 2Preacher

Have you considered asking God for the same anointing that He place upon Jesus when he was baptized in the River Jordan? Eons of seminary training are useless if you don't have the anointing of God.



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 7:10:17 PM)

quote:

Have you considered asking God for the same anointing that He place upon Jesus when he was baptized in the River Jordan? Eons of seminary training are useless if you don't have the anointing of God.


jn1010lf:

I am not exactly sure what you mean? I do ask God to bless the ministry. I ask him to encourage the hearts of others through me and to help me to do it for his Glory and not my own.

That is what I meant by what I said about feeling guilty sometimes. Sometimes I feel like I do it for the Lift I get, rather than for God's glory.
I know that this is wrong and I have confessed it many times. But it really does make me feel better to be able to be used to encourage someone who needs it. I know the glory belongs to God and I give it all to him, but I also receive a big blessing from it.

What do you mean exactly by the "anointing that he placed upon Jesus at his baptism?" I am aware of God's words saying "this is my Son in whom I am well pleased". Is that what you mean?

I do want God to be pleased with me. I want his power to be on my life. I realize that it is necessary for ministry. Is this what you mean?

Please explain.

2Preacher



ironsharpensiron -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 7:30:17 PM)

A great analogy about 'waiting on the Lord' is like that of a food server (waiter/waitress). When a customer sits at a table, he is waited on by the 'server.' The servers are there to refill water glasses, to make sure all is going well with the meal. To be there if anything needs to be done. They are the true 'waiters,' they 'wait' for what the client needs and wants.

If we look at that analogy and put ourselves as the waiters, and God as the diner, then we can see that we are waiting on Him as we do work for Him. Does that make sense..? Wow. I wonder what kind of tip God would leave...[;)]

In your case, 2preacher, you have mentioned that you are doing small ministries here and there. Maybe that is what the Lord wants you to concentrate on at the moment. To possibly prepare you for something exciting that He has planned for you~~Kinda like a big tip for being such a great and patient waiter.

I sense He is preparing you, molding you, shaping you for His purpose and plan. All you need to do is go with the flow and let Him guide you, direct you, and place you where He sends you.

It isn't always easy 'waiting.' The human factor gets in the way and we want answers now, not later. We want action, not little bits here and there.

God is developing in you a patient heart, and one that He will do some awesome wonders with~~only if you wait on Him, and allow Him to dine in your heart.

God bless, my friend.

matthew



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 7:52:58 PM)

Matthew:

Thanks for the encouragement. Humanly, it is tremendously hard to wait because I am not getting any younger ( I'm 46) and I have spent many years in preparation for service. I am not saying that I have arrived. I haven't and no one knows it better than me (except maybe my wife).

What is you take on the following Psalm? Our preacher is doing a series by the same title as this thread- Waiting on God. He is very good and preaches with much conviction and fervor. Read this one through and let me know what you think.

Psalm 62:

1 ¶ <<To the chief Musician, to Jeduthun, A Psalm of David.>> Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation.
2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved.
3 How long will ye imagine mischief against a man? ye shall be slain all of you: as a bowing wall shall ye be, and as a tottering fence.
4 They only consult to cast him down from his excellency: they delight in lies: they bless with their mouth, but they curse inwardly. Selah.
5 My soul, wait thou only upon God; for my expectation is from him.
6 He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved.
7 In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God.


8 ¶ Trust in him at all times; ye people, pour out your heart before him: God is a refuge for us. Selah.
9 Surely men of low degree are vanity, and men of high degree are a lie: to be laid in the balance, they are altogether lighter than vanity.
10 Trust not in oppression, and become not vain in robbery: if riches increase, set not your heart upon them.
11 God hath spoken once; twice have I heard this; that power belongeth unto God.
12 Also unto thee, O Lord, belongeth mercy: for thou renderest to every man according to his work. (KJV)


This Psalm and Pastor's sermon series are the real catalysts for this thread. Give me some feed back.


2Preacher



bzirk -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 8:20:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2Preacher

To all:

Thanks for the helpful advice. My experience has taught me many things. I am still dealing with some issues caused by the problem - mainly discouragement.

God has helped me by giving me opportunities along the way to minister in a variety of ways. I sing in the choir at church, substitute for different Sunday School classes and preach on occasion at our new church when the pastor asks me to . I am also engaged in a ministry at a local nursing home three Sundays a month.

The Lord has blessed this ministry. I have seen four precious senior citizens come to Christ. All of them past the age of 70. The oldest was 93 and a life long Catholic. Three of them passed away not long after accepting the Lord. The last was an 81 year old man who accepted Christ on Father's day.

I have enjoyed this work for the Lord. Sometimes it is difficult because of the age of the people. I get attached to them and then they pass away. It is difficult to say good bye. All of them are very special to my heart.

This ministry eases the pain of my experience. It gives me a release for my pastoral passion. God is blessing it inspite of my ineptness. Sometimes I feel guilty about going because it makes me feel so good to go and minister. Other times I go when I feel down and discouraged, but I always leave feeling that I have been given a bigger blessing than I gave. Sometimes it seems that I go just for the "lift" I get from it.

quote:

In reading your post, though, I am certain that you have claimed forgiveness, but how fully have you forgiven these two pastors who hurt you? They took away your livelihood and your reputation in the church and that is clearly more than one man should bear. Can you say that you have forgiven them despite their apparent unwillingness to seek it? You don't have to answer that here, it is absolutely between you and God.



4IMpersuaded:

I have honestly tried to forgive and to forget. The problem is that I can't seem to "forget". I am constantly reminded of it . Everything around me, especially in church, reminds me of it. I see my Pastor in the pulpit on Sunday and I wonder why I am not preaching somewhere. I teach Sunday School and I wonder why I am not allowed to do it all the time. I see others ministering and I feel that I should be doing it as well. It is very difficult even with the opportunities I have to just sit sometimes.

I know that I am called to pastor. That is what I feel I should be doing. Someone told me once, "if you can do anything else and be happy, don't preach." My answer to that is "I can't". I am not happy doing anything else and it is hard to sit by and wait because of it.

Gotta go for now. Write more later. God knows my heart. He knows where I want to be. I just don't know anymore where he wants me to be.

2Preacher


Before I got to this post, I was thinking that someone who is a pastor will pastor whether they are paid and have a title or not. They will do it because it is what they're called to do and they can't help but do it. So I'm not surprised that you found an outlet.

It would help if you could let go of the preconceived notion you have of how your pastoring is going to look. Maybe it's occurred to you (if so, then it doesn't hurt to hear someone else say it; if not, then you might need to hear it), that the Lord has brought you to that place to minister to those elderly people? It may not be as exciting or as prominent as pastoring a church, but man, what a great thing to be doing and doing it because you love to do it. Hallelujah! We need more people like you doing these things.



bzirk -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 9:04:20 PM)

Now for talkin' a little turkey, and I'm sure that not much I'm going to say is going to be new.

Pastors tend to know many of the stock (or what seem like stock) Biblical answers to life's curve balls. The sad part is that this familiarity can sometimes hinder their continued appreciation for how profound those answers really are.

I wonder how many times you've covered one of these passages:

quote:


Romans 5

2...and we exult in hope of the glory of God.
3And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations,...

II Corinthians 12

8Concerning this I implored the Lord three times that it might leave me. 9And He has said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for power is perfected in weakness " Most gladly, therefore, I will rather boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may dwell in me.

James 1

2 Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials,...


Thankfully, the Lord continues to teach us how profound those truths really are even when we think we have plumbed great depths. He's so good to do the things we cannot do for ourselves -- continually grow us up.

Instructions such as "exult in tribulations" or "boast in weakness" or "consider it all joy to face trials" are very strong words. They're far from "hang in there," or "gut it up," or "this too shall pass," and on and on. The latter can speak of drudgery and entitlement. The former speaks of something that is glorious and something we should certainly be glad to participate in. Paul's words make that plain -- to live is Christ and to die is gain.

Frankly, what a wonderful thing to be in a hard spot, a weak spot, a spot that makes it more necessary to focus on the Lord and acknowledge His presence and His power in our lives and the very real dynamic of Him becoming greater and us becoming less. Wonder if that's what Enoch experienced when he "walked with God."

One more passage that surely must be old hat to you (and I don't say that flippantly at all):

quote:

Philippians 4

4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice!

5Let your gentle spirit be known to all men. The Lord is near.

6Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.

7And the peace of God, which surpasses all comprehension, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.

8Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.

9The things you have learned and received and heard and seen in me, practice these things, and the God of peace will be with you.

God's Provisions
10But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly, that now at last you have revived your concern for me; indeed, you were concerned before, but you lacked opportunity.
11Not that I speak from want, for I have learned to be content in whatever circumstances I am.

12I know how to get along with humble means, and I also know how to live in prosperity; in any and every circumstance I have learned the secret of being filled and going hungry, both of having abundance and suffering need.

13I can do all things through Him who strengthens me.


Whew!

It's an interesting thing that the sensation of being filled or feeling hunger doesn't just apply to food.

Brother, I will pray for you that the Lord's joy and peace will settle on you, and that your portion of wisdom from the Lord will increase such that you won't care if you ever get another church, but rather you will go (and with great joy in the Lord) wherever He chooses to lead you.

Many blessings.



Liveloved -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/25/2008 10:30:42 PM)

quote:

What is you take on the following Psalm? Our preacher is doing a series by the same title as this thread- Waiting on God. He is very good and preaches with much conviction and fervor. Read this one through and let me know what you think.

Psalm 62:


1 ¶ <<To the chief Musician, to Jeduthun, A Psalm of David.>> Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation.
2 He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved.
3 How long will ye imagine mischief against a man? ye shall be slain all of you: as a bowing wall shall ye be, and as a tottering fence.
4 They only consult to cast him down from his excellency: they delight in lies: they bless with their mouth, but they curse inwardly. Selah.
5 My soul, wait thou only upon God; for my expectation is from him.
6 He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved.
7 In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God.


8 ¶ Trust in him at all times; ye people, pour out your heart before him: God is a refuge for us. Selah.
9 Surely men of low degree are vanity, and men of high degree are a lie: to be laid in the balance, they are altogether lighter than vanity.
10 Trust not in oppression, and become not vain in robbery: if riches increase, set not your heart upon them.
11 God hath spoken once; twice have I heard this; that power belongeth unto God.
12 Also unto thee, O Lord, belongeth mercy: for thou renderest to every man according to his work. (KJV)



This Psalm and Pastor's sermon series are the real catalysts for this thread. Give me some feed back.


John Michael Talbot has a beautiful song based on this psalm. It might be a great encouragement for you to find it and listen to it. (Edited to add:
you can find it on YouTube by putting in his name followed by 'only in God'.)

Also have you read Andrew Murray's book, Waiting on God. I have found Murray's thoughts to be extremely helpful in times such as you describe. Blessings.



4IMPersuaded -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/27/2008 8:42:45 PM)

quote:

Frankly, what a wonderful thing to be in a hard spot, a weak spot, a spot that makes it more necessary to focus on the Lord and acknowledge His presence and His power in our lives and the very real dynamic of Him becoming greater and us becoming less. Wonder if that's what Enoch experienced when he "walked with God.


Bzirk, very well said. Pride isn't always about thinking that we are strong enough to go it without God. It sometimes has to do with focusing on our plight and not God. I know this from personal experience, believe me! The evil one is so good at twisting the truth to make us feel used to less than our potential-- as if God is ignoring this gem that is right in front of Him.

2Preacher, my heart truly goes out to you because I understand where you have been. I really do. I don't know what your views on "forgiving and forgetting" are but let me suggest this. When God is said to have remembered something, we wouldn't suggest that His Omnipotence had forgotten something, right? When he remembered the Israelites in their bondage in Egypt, He hadn't misplaced them, had He? No, rather, He was about to act on His thoughts of them. He was about to free them. When He separates us from our sin and remembers them no more, does he have some sort of memory lapse? No, he chooses to act as though we not have sinned against Him. I would not suggest that you forget what has happened to you. No! It is our experience that molds us into the image of Christ if we allow God to shape what we bring before Him. What I believe this to mean, that is, to forget... is to not act on that sense of indignation at the injustice. You can choose to allow God to change your heart so that you can forgive and no longer act as the victim of abuse.

Dear brother, God is not waiting to use you! God is using you right now!! When I was asked to resign from a job in my late 20's I was devastated-- I had succeeded at everything I had done in my life until then. It changed who I was and shook the foundation of my self-esteem. The funny thing about it was that I knew I wasn't where God wanted me to be, but I ignored the "subtle" signs. God decided that if I wasn't going to be obedient, he would go ahead and move me the hard way. I'm not suggesting that what you were doing was outside His will, I'm just saying that He will take this opportunity to strategically move you into the place that He will use your unique skill set to His glory.

You, my friend are on the cusp of a great testimony of hardship and restoration! Bzirk is absolutely right that there is an opportunity for you to trade ashes for beauty and be the object of His splendor!

Blessings on you, dear brother.



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/27/2008 10:02:08 PM)

quote:

to forget... is to not act on that sense of indignation at the injustice. You can choose to allow God to change your heart so that you can forgive and no longer act as the victim of abuse.


4Iampersuaded:

Is this what you think that I am doing? Am I "acting as the victim"? I assure you, brother, this is no act, but I do see your point. I don't really know if I have acted on the "sense of indignation at the injustice". I have not said or done anything to hurt either of these two men. In fact, I have tried to forgive them because Christ has forgiven me of much much worse things. The difficulty comes in when I am reminded of it.

Pastor's message tonight at church was #2 in his series "Growing up the hard way". It was titled, "no one likes to fail". Sometimes that is exactly what I feel like, especially now because I am out of work for the last 8 months. I can't even take care of my family like I want to. It just seems that things are getting slowly worse all the time.

I have been putting out resume's now for over a year and getting no where it seems. O I have had interest from "off the wall stuff" like the junk that comes through e-mail advertising some home based business which in reality is a pyramid scheme or MLM, but no real offers. I am just so tired of the wait. I want it to be over.

I don't mean to sound ungrateful. God has taken care of all of our needs. We are not behind on any of our bills which is amazing in itself considering that our house payment is 1218.00 per month alone and take one whole paycheck of my wifes salary plus to pay. She only gets paid twice a month. God is gracious and good to me, so I really shouldn't complain and I don't mean to sound that way. It's just so hard for me.

How does one "choose to forgive"? Maybe I need a refresher. It is extremely hard when the other person won't even admit their wrong.

Pray for me.

2Preacher



hellochurch -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 1:41:44 AM)

hello 2 preacher,

the thing about people is that they often bother the other guy.

i would say one needs to grow an especially thick skin in life and ignore pretty well everything that others say and or do. (especially if its to you)

in this way you may never be bothered by the other guy again, if you completey ignore what he says and does.

this means do not put any stock whatsoever in it.

enjoy your life with God and follow his direction, and change how you allow others to effect you. fill yourself with gods promises in the word, and exercise faith in them to bring them about in your life.

you can forgive based on obedience to God alone. this means to be completely willing to let go and not hold anything agaisnt them at all. forgive like God or like you want God to forgive you.

YOu can do this by choice and by obedience not based on the other persons' actions or reactions. you dont need them to resolve or forgive. it doesnt matter if they forgive or not, just make sure yo do.



this is wholeheartedly, in and through love for the person, and it is by fogetting what they person has done to you. just forget it completely.

sometimes this is the only surefire survival method is by forgetting.
some sins against others are sins of ignorance, the eprson does not know that that they are sining agaisnt anyone.


remember they are only people and not God. God is great, and can truly love us, mostly other human cannot even do this simple basic thing called love.



Lrenee -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 1:54:48 AM)

I read your posts. And I feel compelled to share. Waiting on God? But I do believe it should read God's waiting on you. Sometimes hurts resurface and those memories punish. When we focus on them they begin to slowly change our minds. Even doubts as to whether or not God indeed is the One who is punishing us by keeping the hand of providence at bay. Many of the thoughts and doubts that we have are simply our inability to let go in order for God to release. Instead we’re busily trying to figure out God instead of just opening ourselves up to His guidance. I think of how human the disciples were. But that didn’t stop God from commissioning them. He knew their faults. But faults don't take our commission away. Why question His good will in your life? Get up on your feet, and take a different approach by changing your frame of mind. You’ve repented. You’ve grown. Get out there and take action.
As even good solid, well learned businessmen are put out of commission in the world of business, they love their work, but that businessman if he is wise will realise that he is just ascapable today as he was yesterday, the only thing that has changed isn't the fact that he is a buisness man but the fact that he is unemployed.
You have a pastors heart, and that's what you should doing. There are people who need to hear God's message, hungering souls that cry out to be saved and unless you speak, they will not hear. The times are getting harder in this world. the world is growing darker. And we need dedicated pastors to preach! But how will they hear that message of hope if you are sitting in a pew waiting for God? Stop troubling yourself with loss of rank sitting in the pew and knowing you should be preaching. If the passion is there, then stir up the faith right along with it. We often prevent ourselves from moving trying to second-guess God.God’s not second-guessing you. He knows who He has chosen. And His plans don’t change! If He commissioned you then consider yourself commissioned. My brother was recently commissioned by the United States Army to be an officer. He was an e-4 fresh out of basic traning. didn’t even have credentials for officer rank except 13 years of medical school and being a researcher at UCLA. They saw his value and called him into their service as someone that was neede.They trusted him because he had shown dedication to his service as a civilian and based upon that he was qualified in their eyes to be entrusted with research for the miltary. If he had doubted their decsion, and instead said, "I'll wait until I feel commissioned ." It would have been a miserable time as he knew what he was commissioned to and yet putt it off. If God has placed in your heart a commission why oh why are you not doing something? Renew your commitment to that passion through faith. Get up and walk! And as you do He’ll be there to take your hand. He’s waiting. Go in your commission! Go in your calling!



small_creation -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 9:01:09 AM)

Perhaps this verse could be for you. Lamentations 3:28. Praise God from whom all blessings flow.

j



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 9:02:41 AM)

Lrenee:

I don't know you, but thank you for your encouraging words. I do need to get up and get back to work. God called me to preach when I was 17 at summer camp in North Carolina. I know it just as sure as I know my own name, but I have been so discouraged.

If, as you said, you read my posts, you know the situation that happened with me. Some of it was my fault. Most of it wasn't. I was not even told why it was done by the first man. The second one only told me that he "didn't need me" as though I was useless. Both of these men treated me with disrespect and dishonor as a fellow Christian, minister, and friend. It just hurt me so deeply.

Maybe I am letting it control me. Maybe I am listening too much to the discouraging voice from within me. It is difficult to know what I am supposed to do any more.

I am not happy working a secular job. I am not even comfortable with it. My heart, my mind, my soul and my family tell me that I should be pastoring. But then there's that voice that comes back to me and says you cannot do it. You're not qualified. "Some people shouldn't be pastors" it says and my heart breaks.

I hear it in my mind. I listen to it and argue with it. I even argue with it out loud sometimes when no one else is around. I have prayed. I have written letters. I've stayed in church. I just don't know what else to do.
It is so hard to wait.

You say that God may be waiting on me. Maybe you are right, but what for?

Thanks again.

2Preacher



4IMPersuaded -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 1:22:59 PM)

quote:

4Iampersuaded:

Is this what you think that I am doing? Am I "acting as the victim"? I assure you, brother, this is no act, but I do see your point. I don't really know if I have acted on the "sense of indignation at the injustice". I have not said or done anything to hurt either of these two men. In fact, I have tried to forgive them because Christ has forgiven me of much much worse things. The difficulty comes in when I am reminded of it


Oh, no... you misunderstood my point and I'm sorry. What I meant was that you were victimized, but that God is bigger than those who have sinned against you. And to use a cliche, He is fully able and willing to use all things for good and to His glory-- even the ugly things that happen in our lives.

I can hear your heart breaking in your posts and my heart breaks right alongside you. I am blinking back tears as I post this. Perhaps choosing to forgive isn't the right phrase. It is harder than that. It is a matter of inviting God to change your heart-- which I know you have, but the process includes taking those destructive thoughts captive. The enemy is so skilled at deceit! Remember, he has been telling humanity lies just like this since the beginning of the ages. His tricks are old, but effective-- that's why he keeps using them! Praying without ceasing is the only way to get through this. Day by day is sometimes too much of a time period when we are hurting and waiting-- sometimes it is minute by minute.

You know, one of the reasons that the enemy is likely attacking you so relentlessly is because he is fully aware of how effective you can be for the Kingdom. By feeding you the lies of worthlessness and doubt, he is trying to keep you in defeat. but the beauty is that you hold the key to that particular cell-- it is in your faith in the One who broke the chains for you.

For some reason God has allowed circumstances to convene that result in you sitting in the congregation instead of shepherding a flock. It is quite likely that God has freed you up for a purpose that does use your gifts and talents but is "outside the box". He is either acting to put things in place for you or waiting on you to see the opportunity. Again, He is not sitting still or ignoring you-- He loves you too much to allow your heart to hurt over this without a solution. I just saw this principle at work in my own life yesterday.

Last spring, my husband and I were convinced that God was calling us to a different part of the country. My husband had been interviewed and seemed to be the guy to beat for the position. We were really excited to embark on this new journey with God. I started cleaning closets! Inexplicably, he did not get the job and we were sent reeling. I couldn't believe that I had been so wrong about His will for us. We found out yesterday that the company is now laying off a large percentage of managers and dh would have been one of those to go-- we would have been so far up the creek, I can't tell you. All the while I was doubting God, He was faithfully caring for me, my dh and my children and I can't tell you how my heart fills with gratitude over it.

Dear Preacher, you are loved and God is faithful above all else. You will see in time how He has had you in the palm of His hand all of the time. He is clearly providing for you financially-- He will fulfill the desire of your heart. Of that I am persuaded!

(Okay, that last part was corny, I admit.) (((hugs)))



4IMPersuaded -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 1:29:12 PM)

quote:

Pray for me.


With pleasure!

Dear Precious Father,

I know that you have this dear brother close to your heart and I pray right now that you will begin to reveal to him you will for his life. He wants so much to serve you with his whole being and I know that is exactly the sort of heart that You are seeking in this life. Please make your will clear for him, please satisfy his desire to serve You and the people that You have called him to love.

Please clear away his doubt and refresh the joy in his life. Lord, free him from his pain and bind up the enemy from him so that his mind can be loosed to concentrate on you.

In Your Son's Name I pray,
Amen



MrSteve -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 7:25:17 PM)


Waiting on God is about the hardest thing I've ever done. I'm in my 3rd go around (since mid February) of unemployment over the past 20 + years and while every time God comes through it has never been an easy thing to go through... Lot's of ground for the enemy to sow his little seeds. I do know that God has, does and will provide though...!

This I declare about the Lord; He alone is my refuge, my place of safety. he is
my God, and I trust Him.

Psalm 91.2
New Living Translation



ironsharpensiron -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/28/2008 10:46:08 PM)

quote:

I am not happy working a secular job. I am not even comfortable with it. My heart, my mind, my soul and my family tell me that I should be pastoring


I had felt this way for many years myself. Although I have been involved with ministeries all through my life I have never done it as a fulltime occupation. Over the past few years the Lord has been tugging at me and letting me know that now is the time. I am currently working on my pastoral credentials and Master's in Christian Counseling/psychology. All the years of counseling, and encouraging hurting people has given me a lot of knowledge. Now is the time to use the life lessons and to apply them in fulltime ministry.

I wrote all that to say this...

I would not have had those countless life lessons if I did not have secular jobs/careers during the course of my life. They have helped me to grow, and not only learn about who I am, but who others are, and that is what is enabling me to help them now. Does that make sense..?

Through those years, sure, I questioned God. Wondered why I was placed at those places of employment. Why, Lord..? Why this place..? If you have called me to fulltime ministry why isn't it happening..?

Those questions I asked countless times~~And I have a gut feeling you have been as well.

A few years ago the Lord gave me a series of Bible studies for the small group I was leading; 'God's Placement.' Using five very minor, and seemingly insignificant people (although now I know they were certainly not insignificant) God made some mighty victories that truly glorified Him. I can PM you some of those later if you would like.

My point is that even though we don't know or even understand why God places us in the jobs He does, He knows why, and in it He will eventually be glorified. I truly believe He places us so that we can be an encouragement to others, and oftimes others can be encouraging to us.

I sometimes look back at all the people I have met and worked with over the years; the Biblical advice I have given out, the love to people that felt no love at home, and the like...You see what I'm getting at..?

We are light to the world. God is placing us in situations where we will touch people's lives, and where live's will touch our hearts. All in all He places us where He will be glorified.

Much like Jonah, even though he didn't want to go to Ninevah, eventually when he did, God, through him, touched the hearts of all there, and what happened..? They all came to know and revere the only Living God. Look at your workplace as Ninevah...who there needs to be touched by the love of God...

matthew



2Preacher -> RE: Waiting on God? (8/29/2008 12:04:24 AM)

quote:

4Iampersuaded:

Is this what you think that I am doing? Am I "acting as the victim"? I assure you, brother, this is no act, but I do see your point. I don't really know if I have acted on the "sense of indignation at the injustice". I have not said or done anything to hurt either of these two men. In fact, I have tried to forgive them because Christ has forgiven me of much much worse things. The difficulty comes in when I am reminded of it


quote:

Oh, no... you misunderstood my point and I'm sorry. What I meant was that you were victimized, but that God is bigger than those who have sinned against you. And to use a cliche, He is fully able and willing to use all things for good and to His glory-- even the ugly things that happen in our lives.



4IMPersuaded:

I appreciate your kind words. I really did understand your point in your last post. Some times I do feel and act like a victim. It is very difficult not to. A normal person would think that I should be over this especially since it has been 4 years since it happened. People may not say it, but I know they are thinking "just get over it", but when you spend almost 20 years of your life preparing for and doing the only job you ever loved only to watch it go up in smoke because of a lie, "just getting over it" is much easier said than done.

I admit to being bitter and that is my own fault. I have allowed it. There really is no excuse for it and that is the first thing that must be dealt with on my part. You're right about - "It is a matter of inviting God to change your heart-- which I know you have, but the process includes taking those destructive thoughts captive." This is where I fail miserably.

quote:

"Praying without ceasing is the only way to get through this. Day by day is sometimes too much of a time period when we are hurting and waiting-- sometimes it is minute by minute."


It really is this way. When I pray about it, the problem eases and it seems my day goes much better. If I could just remember to do it as I should. Please pray that I would be more consistent.

quote:

Dear Preacher, you are loved and God is faithful above all else. You will see in time how He has had you in the palm of His hand all of the time. He is clearly providing for you financially-- He will fulfill the desire of your heart. Of that I am persuaded!


Me too! If it weren't for his faithfulness, I don't know what I would do. Here is something the Lord gave me a few years ago. It is a poem that I wrote and put to music. I am still learning it's full meaning.

I know God will make a way,
He is faithful every day.
On His promises I'll stand,
I'll keep holding to his hand.
Though the way seems long and drear,
My heart knows that he is near,
And I know God will make a way for me.

When you cannot see the light,
Through the darkness of the night,
Just remember, He is there.
Our God always answers prayer.
He will make a way for you,
And He will see you safely through,
I know God will make a way for you.

When the race of life is run,
And the Victory is won,
We will stand on Heavens shore,
We will hear Him say well done.
Looking back through years of time,
I'll see his footprints next to mine,
And I'll know God has made a way for me.

God is faithful.
God is true.
What he promises, he'll do!
Where he sends, He will provide.
In his love I will abide,
And I know God will make a way for me.

@copyright, 2003


God bless you, 4IMpersuaded, I really do appreciate your words. They are an encouragement to me. Pray that I find a job soon and that I will allow God to work and depend on Him.

Thanks again.

2Preacher



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