Clothing = Modesty??? (Full Version)

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McGuinessMagee -> Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 9:00:43 AM)

I've read so often in threads (too many to number, but another one caught my attention just a moment ago) where people equate clothing with modesty.

Yes, to a degree, clothing can indicate a person's level of modesty, but I think it's a very dangerous line of thought because there are many women who dress to please those around them (whether that be high necked poloshirts and long skirts or skimpy bikinis) and it seems to be completely missed that modesty is a spiritual matter not a clothing issue.

There are a lot of covered up, immodest women and there are a lot of uncovered, modest women walking around in this world. I would far prefer my husband hanging around a woman who was half-naked but respected his married relationship than a woman who dressed according the the current 'christian' dress code and thought that flirting was no big deal.

I guess I'm just throwing this out there as fodder, but I'd love others thoughts too.

Kylie[sm=silly.gif]



Sideways -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 10:11:47 AM)

Well, in mixed gender threads you'll have the men telling you that because men cannot control themselves, women must be as covered as possible, so as not to cause men to sin. [8|] Now, I find a man most attractive when he's covered up in a nice suit, so does that mean men should dress ratty and unattractive so as not to cause me to sin? I think not.

That being said, how you dress does affect how people think of you, how they treat you, etc. Fair or not, it's just how humans work. And time and place affect what is modest, as well. It is appropriate to wear a swimsuit to the beach, but not to church.

I think it is best if we try to dress appropriate to the occasion, but I don't think we automatically need to be covered head to toe. And you're absolutely right that how we act towards others shows even more about modesty then our dress.

Because someone might think I'm immodest for wearing long-ish shorts, but I can still conduct myself in a way that is respectful and kind to my fellow humans, which says a lot more about my character then the fact that I'm wearing shorts.



Mrs.Wifey -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 10:51:36 AM)

quote:

That being said, how you dress does affect how people think of you, how they treat you, etc. Fair or not, it's just how humans work.

[sm=thumbsup.gif]

I totally agree, Ruth. (Micah and I have been told we have "image issues" by people who don't believe that how we dress affects how we are perceived)

Kylie, I do agree that modesty is about attitude just as much as it is about clothing. I think also that it's not just modesty in the sexual sense, but modesty as far as pride goes as well.



zoebob -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 11:40:20 AM)

I think it is both. There are certain things that need to be covered up but it also has to be done with the right attitude.



spitzu -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 1:41:59 PM)

I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly... but I guess modest can mean many things to many people.



cynthia -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 2:12:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: spitzu

I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly... but I guess modest can mean many things to many people.

I agree with this.
A modest person does not call undo attention to herself and does not expose her private body parts to the public. But the key is that the person is modest, therefore, her behavior will come out of the attitude of her heart. When we see someone dressed in a modest fashion, we can see that the clothing is modest, but we cannot judge if that is because she is modest or not. Otoh, it is pretty obvious when we see a woman with her breasts hanging out or propped up and displayed that she isn't modest, as she is obviously trying to display herself.



3cappuccinosmom -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 2:31:39 PM)

quote:

I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly


Me too. It's not either/or, it's *both*.

I would rather my husband hung out with women who respected marriage and purity and who also dressed modestly than either a fully-clothed seductress or a sweet but near-naked bikini-wearer. [;)]



OneOfHisJewels -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 2:46:05 PM)

quote:

quote:

I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly


Me too. It's not either/or, it's *both*.


Me three. To me, trying to separate the two sides of modesty, is like trying to say a quarter is only heads or only tails. Now, I will use an example from my own life that shows I do to some extent understand where the op is coming from. I tried being "dresses only," for a while, but had to stop, because FOR ME it simply caused me to have a self righteous attitude (I'm NOT saying Maggie or Lexie, or any other dresses only person is self righteous, I don't think you are at all, I'm just saying, that's how it played out FOR ME).

(Edited to fix formatting)



Sideways -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 2:55:15 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: spitzu
I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly... but I guess modest can mean many things to many people.


That's very true, but the subjectivity of modesty is why I brought up the shorts example. To some, shorts can be modest, to others, shorts are incredibly immodest and no Chrisitan woman should ever be see outside the home in one.

Now, I'm not talking about daisy dukes type shorts, but you get my drift.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 5:41:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sideways

quote:

ORIGINAL: spitzu
I would think people with a modest mindset would want to dress modestly... but I guess modest can mean many things to many people.


That's very true, but the subjectivity of modesty is why I brought up the shorts example. To some, shorts can be modest, to others, shorts are incredibly immodest and no Chrisitan woman should ever be see outside the home in one.

Now, I'm not talking about daisy dukes type shorts, but you get my drift.

I get what you mean...I think long shorts are modest on other women, but I don't wear shorts at all...on me I don't think they look modest enough for my own sensitivities. In general though I wouldn't say they were immodest.



McGuinessMagee -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 7:01:54 PM)

quote:

That's very true, but the subjectivity of modesty is why I brought up the shorts example. To some, shorts can be modest, to others, shorts are incredibly immodest and no Chrisitan woman should ever be see outside the home in one.


I think this is more where I was heading with this subject.

I have known Christian women who just didn't get that the way they were dressing could be construed as immodest because they had grown up with poor examples of modest dress and, well... compared to what their Mum and sisters wore, they were getting around in their demographics equivalent of a burka.

But yet, according to the young women of the church, who had no problems flirting with the married youth pastor, the woman whose clothes didn't match the 'Christian' image was the immodest one.

???

Kylie



Mrs.X -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 7:48:46 PM)

Are you talking just-above-the-knee type short or like Bermuda shorts? I would consider those modest.

I agree with Crystal that a woman who is modest on the inside would also be modest on the outside.



cynthia -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 7:58:22 PM)

All of our behavior comes out of what we believe.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 8:07:44 PM)

quote:

Are you talking just-above-the-knee type short or like Bermuda shorts? I would consider those modest.

I was talking long shorts if you are asking me. For my girls we prefer to the knee...shortest we would ever allow (and really don't like on Hannah cause she is all legs) is fingertip length.


quote:

ORIGINAL: cynthia

All of our behavior comes out of what we believe.

yup!!



OneOfHisJewels -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 8:21:05 PM)

quote:

But yet, according to the young women of the church, who had no problems flirting with the married youth pastor, the woman whose clothes didn't match the 'Christian' image was the immodest one.


Magee, what you are dealing with here is not a modesty issue, but rather a hypocrisy/log and speck issue. This situation reminded me of THIS country music song.



cynthia -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 8:24:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OneOfHisJewels
Magee, what you are dealing with here is not a modesty issue, but rather a hypocrisy/log and speck issue.

That is exactly what I was thinking.



W.O.F. -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 10:08:12 PM)

Modesty is a heart issue...and will be reflected in the behaviour and clothing choices men and women make.

Clothing alone does not equal modesty....but a modest attitude alone does not equal modesty either. They have to work together to evaluate each situation as to what would bring glory to Christ and not to the wearer/doer.

It really comes down to...if we are dressing a certain way (either half-naked or according to modest rules) for the attention it gets US....we are in the wrong.

It isn't about me. It is about Christ, and my brothers and sisters in Christ whom I might offend.


Amazingly enough...in the women I know who are truly modest from the inside out...they are the least likely to judge someone else based on their clothing...for example...I remember once when I was a young girl, a young teen/20 something came into our church..and was dressed like a hooker....even I recognized that at age 8! Our pastor and several of teh OLDER more strict ladies welcomed her to service and hugged her and the oldest and strictest lady asked her to sit with her. Nothing was said about her clothing. They were all just genuinely glad to see her in church. She came back the next Sunday dressed the same way....same reaction...only this time part way through church...she asked the lady she was sitting with if she could borrow her sweater to cover up what her top did not. The next week...repeat. After about 4 months...this young woman got saved. She showed up in jeans and a t-shirt...and was welcomed and loved even though at that point and time, even in more relaxed churches, girls didn't wear jeans and t-shirts to Sunday morning service....but she was modest...inside and out..and it was God and the love of the people of God who did what He asked that allowed her to find that place.



cynthia -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 10:16:23 PM)

WOF, That about made me cry. That is truly the way to win the hearts of people.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/23/2008 10:29:31 PM)

that truly is the love of Christ WOF. One of the things that kind of bugs me about a church we are "visiting" right now is a sign at their door with the words "Dress code is modest, remember we are in Church". I find it a bit degrading of people like you listed who NEED the love of Christ but might not get it simply because they don't know what "church dress" is all about...that it isn't just an outside issue, it's a heart issue. I think they have it all wrong.



BlessedMamaofmany -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 6:24:17 AM)

right on WOF. That's such a wonderful story.

Modesty and dress do go hand in hand I think. My tuesday night women's group just had a discussion about this a couple of weeks ago.

Sandy



lexie -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 9:47:39 AM)

Our church used to have a pretty strict dress policy but has been lightening up a lot recently which is good.

I used to have a pastor who said "God doesn't care what you wear, as long as you are there." Well, that's true to a point. God does want you there no matter what, but we still need to make an effort to be properly covered (both men and women). (The context this line came in was whether or not it was proper to wear jeans to church, btw.)

quote:

Clothing alone does not equal modesty....but a modest attitude alone does not equal modesty either. They have to work together to evaluate each situation as to what would bring glory to Christ and not to the wearer/doer.


I love this line. Recently, there was some upset by some others in our church over what the pastor's wife was wearing. She was wearing her skirts and her blazers or shirts that covered her shoulders (because that is what the church wants you to wear) but they always seem to be one or two sizes too small. With her body type, sometimes her clothing is not modest even though it "conforms" to the dress code of the church.

OneofHisJewels mentioned dresses only and then said it wasn't directed at me (and I know it wasn't[;)]) but I did want to touch on one thing quickly - when I first started attending my church I was told that you shouldn't wear pants because they allow people to see your entire shape and that isn't appropriate. However, when I did begin to wear skirts, I found that I was getting much more male attention.

What I did find interesting is other women in the church were wearing skirts to the knee, pantyhose with designs and stiletto heels or knee high boots (which I do wear as well) but were saying they were modest because they had a skirt on. Umm....nope! I could point out hundreds of women wearing pants who were more modest than them.

So modesty isn't just about wearing a certain clothing item, it is about the heart. Because when in your heart you are truly striving to be appropriate, you will dress yourself modestly no matter what form of clothing you are wearing.



nanato3 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 2:17:43 PM)

I noticed something interesting at our church. We used to see girls that would come in some pretty scant outfits. At that time we had a pastor that was pretty strict & old fashioned in ways. When he left our new pastor was more relaxed he announced he had 2 suits one for marrying one for burying. On Sunday mornings he's dressed in a nice shirt & pants but no suit no tie, but I've noticed the dress among the girls has become more modest. I find that interesting. I agree that it goes two ways but I'm wrong & I know I am but I tend to think the way you dress is probably the way you are. If you are dressed with things hanging out you want people to look at you, people are going to get the wrong message. The way you dress does send messages.



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 2:26:35 PM)

quote:

The way you dress does send messages.

I agree...it does send messages...however I do not think a church needs to have a "dress code" for the whole church to follow....the staff? sure...deacons/board members? sure....pastor? sure....but not everyone that walks in the door. You can't expect God to change the heart if you won't let the body in the church door for their heart to be ministered to.



spitzu -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 2:30:20 PM)

I wonder how many would think I'm immodest... in this heat, no way my shorts go to my knee!



peculiar_lady2 -> RE: Clothing = Modesty??? (8/24/2008 2:32:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: spitzu

I wonder how many would think I'm immodest... in this heat, no way my shorts go to my knee!

my own personal preferences are for me and my kids, not everyone else...so I probably would still find you modest even if it wasn't something we would wear.



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