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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:37:01 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bob_George
quote:
ORIGINAL: stampinlady
quote:
WE get a pitbull with lipstick.
Tracy, would you say this if she were Black?
No comparison. Blacks have a history of oppression. Whites don't. So to say something demeaning to a black person, coming from a white person, has a very different effect than anyone saying something demeaning to a white person.
yes, because race matters!!! it's ok to be racist!!! (sarcasm)...
history aside, it shouldn't matter...so why haven't we moved on?
when will we be done with the racial fist-fightings, BOTH WAYS!!!
it ends when both sides agree to move on and let by-gones be by-gones (if that is spelled right?)...this was MLK's dream, for it to be a non-factor, and wow, i know i am on a tangent.
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:37:13 AM
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Sophie11
Posts: 777
Joined: 1/24/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: raivyne
Saying something demeaning about anyone is equally heinous. As if white people don't get to feel insults and lies as much as minorities because they are what? white?!??? asinine.
Exactly.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:39:04 AM
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iluvatar
Posts: 1952
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
quote:
ORIGINAL: ManimalX
and painted a very sharp contrast between the candidate of the teleprompter speech
You know she was reading off a teleprompter, right?
-Dan.
Yes, they all do.
I have notes for my sermons, does that make me insencere, or just keep me on point.
Thanks
RC
I don't fault anybody for using a teleprompter - actually, I'd rather them use a teleprompter than written notes, because at least then they wouldn't be looking down at the podium all the time.
My point was addressed to ManimalX who was taking a shot at Obama for speaking from a teleprompter.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:40:51 AM
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Rufas2000
Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
Women also have a past history of oppression.
Wouldn't the statement be "history of being oppressed"? "History of oppression" makes it sound like they were the ones oppressing others. At the very least "history of oppression" doesn't make it clear whether they were victim or aggressor.
I'm not trying to be the grammar cops here but it was unclear. You never know what someone might say here. Fortunately the context of the posts cleared up any potential confusion.
_____________________________
Be my friend!
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:45:51 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
quote:
ORIGINAL: ManimalX
and painted a very sharp contrast between the candidate of the teleprompter speech
You know she was reading off a teleprompter, right?
-Dan.
Yes, they all do.
I have notes for my sermons, does that make me insencere, or just keep me on point.
Thanks
RC
I don't fault anybody for using a teleprompter - actually, I'd rather them use a teleprompter than written notes, because at least then they wouldn't be looking down at the podium all the time.
My point was addressed to ManimalX who was taking a shot at Obama for speaking from a teleprompter.
-Dan.
i understand your direction Dan, but methinks that ManimalX's shot at BO was the fact that his success is primarily built out of his speeches, at least that is what i believe. and believe me, i am not discrediting him as a speaker, but a legislator.
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:48:55 AM
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Bob_George
Posts: 177
Joined: 9/4/2008
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quote:
This is such a tired ridiculous excuse. People are people, and being offended is being offended, regardless of color.
But in the same sense as your answer, what about the fact that she is a woman? Women also have a past history of oppression. Is she exempt from criticism due to the fact that she is a woman?
quote:
Saying something demeaning about anyone is equally heinous. As if white people don't get to feel insults and lies as much as minorities because they are what? white?!??? asinine. what utter and foolish NONSENSE!
quote:
Yes, because race matters!!! it's ok to be racist!!! (sarcasm)...
history aside, it shouldn't matter...so why haven't we moved on?
when will we be done with the racial fist-fightings, BOTH WAYS!!!
it ends when both sides agree to move on and let by-gones be by-gones (if that is spelled right?)...this was MLK's dream, for it to be a non-factor, and wow, i know i am on a tangent.
It would be great if race was a non-issue. But it isn't. Not yet. Racism exists. That's why saying something to a black person has a different effect than saying the same thing to a white person. That's how it is. And in all honesty, so it should be. If a group of people have a history of oppression they do deserve a little sympathy and a little... I don't want to say "special treatment" because that sounds wrong, but you get what I mean. I think a lot of white people would love to say whatever they could about black people and throw around the "N word" like they do. But they have to understand that words directed a black person have a different effect coming from you.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:56:43 AM
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Sophie11
Posts: 777
Joined: 1/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rufas2000
quote:
Women also have a past history of oppression.
Wouldn't the statement be "history of being oppressed"? "History of oppression" makes it sound like they were the ones oppressing others. At the very least "history of oppression" doesn't make it clear whether they were victim or aggressor.
I'm not trying to be the grammar cops here but it was unclear. You never know what someone might say here. Fortunately the context of the posts cleared up any potential confusion.
???
You seriously spent the time to type me a lesson in grammar????
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 9:57:03 AM
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raivyne
Posts: 881
Joined: 8/28/2008
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Just because YOU perceive it differently does NOT mean it is any different. period. I am a woman of native american descent (talk about oppression) and I feel the same pain as ANYONE else who has been insulted. good grief you don't get a special gene that makes you hurt more because you are black, white, red, purple or blue!!
I will however agree that racial slights are particularly painful as there is nothing anyone can do about their heritage... but that goes for ANYONE of ANY color who is on the receiving end of that sort of mean spirited comment.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:14:48 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bob_George
quote:
This is such a tired ridiculous excuse. People are people, and being offended is being offended, regardless of color.
But in the same sense as your answer, what about the fact that she is a woman? Women also have a past history of oppression. Is she exempt from criticism due to the fact that she is a woman?
quote:
Saying something demeaning about anyone is equally heinous. As if white people don't get to feel insults and lies as much as minorities because they are what? white?!??? asinine. what utter and foolish NONSENSE!
quote:
Yes, because race matters!!! it's ok to be racist!!! (sarcasm)...
history aside, it shouldn't matter...so why haven't we moved on?
when will we be done with the racial fist-fightings, BOTH WAYS!!!
it ends when both sides agree to move on and let by-gones be by-gones (if that is spelled right?)...this was MLK's dream, for it to be a non-factor, and wow, i know i am on a tangent.
It would be great if race was a non-issue. But it isn't. Not yet. Racism exists. That's why saying something to a black person has a different effect than saying the same thing to a white person. That's how it is. And in all honesty, so it should be. If a group of people have a history of oppression they do deserve a little sympathy and a little... I don't want to say "special treatment" because that sounds wrong, but you get what I mean. I think a lot of white people would love to say whatever they could about black people and throw around the "N word" like they do. But they have to understand that words directed a black person have a different effect coming from you.
when does it end then??? when does the healing begin??? someone has to want to be healed....
if we want to move on, then we have to go. sympathy was there in the past, now lets go. does your mom hold you now because you stubbed your toe when you were 5???
now, if you don't want to move on, then i am afraid that there will always be a racial divide. there will always be hurt.
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:16:46 AM
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Sophie11
Posts: 777
Joined: 1/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bob_George
It would be great if race was a non-issue. But it isn't. Not yet. Racism exists. That's why saying something to a black person has a different effect than saying the same thing to a white person. That's how it is. And in all honesty, so it should be. If a group of people have a history of oppression they do deserve a little sympathy and a little... I don't want to say "special treatment" because that sounds wrong, but you get what I mean. I think a lot of white people would love to say whatever they could about black people and throw around the "N word" like they do. But they have to understand that words directed a black person have a different effect coming from you.
Well first of all, I do not want to turn this thread into a conversation on race relations, because there is already an existing thread elsewhere for that topic.
However, when you speak of racism still existing, these views are part of the problem. In order for race to truly be irrelevant both sides have to agree to treat it as such, not just one. I am tired of white people being told they must walk on eggshells when speaking to a black person so as not to offend them, as if all black people are so delicate and simply looking for racism in every word. That is not the way it is, nor the way it should be.
And I am also tired of the arguement that the "N word" is fine to hear coming from a black person but not from a white. If it is offensive, does the meaning change simply because of the color of the skin of the one speaking? I think not.
I believe that black people deserve not to be oppressed. I do not believe that they deserve special treatment. The fact is that most black people today in this country have never experienced slavery firsthand, and most white people alive in this country today have never been involved in keeping black slaves. As for myself personally, my family moved to the US from Hungary during the second World War. They were not here during the time before equal rights. Why should I feel guilty for something of which I had no part? I can feel for the slaves on a human level and feel for their families, but guilt is not one of my feelings and I refuse to listen to those who tell me I must treat all black people as if they have the thinnest skin in the world and cannot understand that I mean no harm. If I happen to say something that has a different meaning to black people than to white because of history and culture, then I guess I would just expect they would understand what I meant or politely ask me to clarify, which would be no problem.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:18:35 AM
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tracydolls
Posts: 1839
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
when does it end then??? when does the healing begin??? someone has to want to be healed....
if we want to move on, then we have to go. sympathy was there in the past, now lets go. does your mom hold you now because you stubbed your toe when you were 5???
now, if you don't want to move on, then i am afraid that there will always be a racial divide. there will always be hurt.
Jer 51:9 We would have healed Babylon, but she is not healed: forsake her, and let us go every one into his own country: for her judgment reacheth unto heaven, and is lifted up even to the skies.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:19:22 AM
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rnershigh
Posts: 1195
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: somewhere over the rainbow
Status: offline
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No offense tracydolls, but could we drop the race discussion?
I know there has to be a thread around here that is devoted for that subject.
IIRC, I know I remember seeing one so could you please talk about race there or else create one yourself?
Every thread you post in, you inevitably bring in the race card and hijack the thread and attack white people.
I, for one, would like to talk about the topic which is Palin.
Anyways, I think the OP was referring to Obama's inability to talk without it being written out for him beforehand.
This is only Palin's first step out onto the national stage, but I think she did very well.
Like someone else stated, she had enormous pressure on her the past few days ever since she was chosen by McCain to be his VP and I think she did a stand-up job last night.
I also look forward to the VP debates, it'll be lively that's for sure. 
_____________________________
O Grave! where is thy Victory?
O Death! where is thy Sting?
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:23:19 AM
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Rufas2000
Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
You seriously spent the time to type me a lesson in grammar????
Not just you, more to the point it was the other person. It honestly took me a sec to get what he was trying to say. But the context made it clear.
You don't think its possible that some nut would come on here and try to advance the position that blacks have been the oppressors?
_____________________________
Be my friend!
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:25:30 AM
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Sophie11
Posts: 777
Joined: 1/24/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Rufas2000
quote:
You seriously spent the time to type me a lesson in grammar????
Not just you, more to the point it was the other person. It honestly took me a sec to get what he was trying to say. But the context made it clear.
You don't think its possible that some nut would come on here and try to advance the position that blacks have been the oppressors?
Oh I guess I misunderstood your post then. Oops!
And no, I haven't thought of that possibility, which was probably what led to my confusion over your comments!
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:27:25 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sophie11
quote:
ORIGINAL: Bob_George
It would be great if race was a non-issue. But it isn't. Not yet. Racism exists. That's why saying something to a black person has a different effect than saying the same thing to a white person. That's how it is. And in all honesty, so it should be. If a group of people have a history of oppression they do deserve a little sympathy and a little... I don't want to say "special treatment" because that sounds wrong, but you get what I mean. I think a lot of white people would love to say whatever they could about black people and throw around the "N word" like they do. But they have to understand that words directed a black person have a different effect coming from you.
Well first of all, I do not want to turn this thread into a conversation on race relations, because there is already an existing thread elsewhere for that topic.
However, when you speak of racism still existing, these views are part of the problem. In order for race to truly be irrelevant both sides have to agree to treat it as such, not just one. I am tired of white people being told they must walk on eggshells when speaking to a black person so as not to offend them, as if all black people are so delicate and simply looking for racism in every word. That is not the way it is, nor the way it should be.
And I am also tired of the arguement that the "N word" is fine to hear coming from a black person but not from a white. If it is offensive, does the meaning change simply because of the color of the skin of the one speaking? I think not.
I believe that black people deserve not to be oppressed. I do not believe that they deserve special treatment. The fact is that most black people today in this country have never experienced slavery firsthand, and most white people alive in this country today have never been involved in keeping black slaves. As for myself personally, my family moved to the US from Hungary during the second World War. They were not here during the time before equal rights. Why should I feel guilty for something of which I had no part? I can feel for the slaves on a human level and feel for their families, but guilt is not one of my feelings and I refuse to listen to those who tell me I must treat all black people as if they have the thinnest skin in the world and cannot understand that I mean no harm. If I happen to say something that has a different meaning to black people than to white because of history and culture, then I guess I would just expect they would understand what I meant or politely ask me to clarify, which would be no problem.
i could never say that i was in any more agreement than i am now. Sophie, you hit the nail on the coffin. heck, the first paragraph speaks the meaning NEEDED.
you know the dream.
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:30:12 AM
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ken1906_4
Posts: 272
Joined: 10/6/2006
From: Maryland
Status: offline
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Good speech. 
Unfortunately there was one thing that stood out to me that millions of people across America past and present should take offense to. Her comment about community leaders and community groups was not only insulting, but it was....well....for lack of a better word elitist. So that means the leaders of the women’s suffrage movement, the civil rights movement, abolitionist(back in slavery days), Church's, NAACP, Fraternities, Sororities, and many other community organizations and the work that has been done and still being done meant and means nothing. It pretty much belittled anyone who has served, helped or done something for someone else in the thousands of communities across this nation. Ok, she may have been talking about Obama, but she also took a swipe at all community leaders and groups.
_____________________________
"Choosing between Republicans and Democrats is like choosing between the Pharisees and Sadducees. Both are enemies of Christ."
True colors are being revealed
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:30:40 AM
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SwedishCovenant
Posts: 606
Joined: 8/8/2008
Status: offline
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You want oppression?
Try being a geeky white kid in a mostly-minority inner city public junior high school.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:33:18 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SwedishCovenant
You want oppression?
Try being a geeky white kid in a mostly-minority inner city public junior high school.
i can't believe my eyes...i am agreeing with Swedey...
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:34:56 AM
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SwedishCovenant
Posts: 606
Joined: 8/8/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: huskarine
quote:
ORIGINAL: SwedishCovenant
You want oppression?
Try being a geeky white kid in a mostly-minority inner city public junior high school.
i can't believe my eyes...i am agreeing with Swedey...
We agree more than you know.
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:36:35 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SwedishCovenant
quote:
ORIGINAL: huskarine
quote:
ORIGINAL: SwedishCovenant
You want oppression?
Try being a geeky white kid in a mostly-minority inner city public junior high school.
i can't believe my eyes...i am agreeing with Swedey...
We agree more than you know.
i look forward to discovering more...
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:37:25 AM
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Matt Smith
Posts: 57
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Austin, TX
Status: offline
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I've been reading the news for commentary on her speech. They talk about her attacking Obama and promoting McCain. I can't find anyone talking about the substance of her speech. Did she talk about any policy positions? Anything about the economy?
Matt
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:37:32 AM
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ManimalX
Posts: 1261
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
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Move the race discussion somewhere else, please.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:43:08 AM
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huskarine
Posts: 444
Joined: 7/31/2008
From: Wheaton, IL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ManimalX
Move the race discussion somewhere else, please.
ManimalX, i will personally apologize for exploding the topic irrelevant to the thread.
on topic: i thought her speech to be on target and building of the GOP base. People now need to pay attention to what McCain has to say. this is the meat of the convention.
however, i delight in McCain honoring his constituencies with the selection of Palin, and him coming out last night after the speech confirms such.
_____________________________
"Success is equated with excess/the ambition for excess wrecks us/as the top of the mind becomes the bottom line/when success is equated with excess" -Switchfoot "American Dream"
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RE: Sarah Palin's RNC Speech (a real thread) - 9/4/2008 10:49:54 AM
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tracydolls
Posts: 1839
Joined: 3/30/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
I've been reading the news for commentary on her speech. They talk about her attacking Obama and promoting McCain. I can't find anyone talking about the substance of her speech. Did she talk about any policy positions? Anything about the economy?
What is she gonna say? I am in agreement with you losing your jobs by the 10000's , 1000's more years in Iraq, more tax cuts for the wealthly,
funding terrorists.
shes got to wait for the Bush's people to write her some more speeches and policies.
_____________________________
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
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