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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 8:55:02 AM
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RamiRedeemed
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I read this too and I was so shocked. All to save a few bucks on whatever.
About the after christmas shopping though, ya all, I am totally a line waiter! Last year I was at walmart at 5am with a whole bunch of ravenous women lol. When they let us in everyone was racing towards the seasonal stuff to get the 50% off sales and I saw one lone man walking toward oncoming traffic. I wish I would've had a camera, the look on his face was priceless! It was like he was scared to death, 50 women running in his direction LOL. I wanted to put him in my shopping basket and wrap him with a blanket, he looked so terrified.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 11:13:58 AM
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TwinCityGirl
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quote:
ORIGINAL: KatMack
We do have to remember that this was ONE STORE out of 1000s that were open on Friday. I understand the frustration, the anger, the disappointment, but to take this one incident and extrapolate that all Americans or all people are like this isn't the answer. Yes a man lost his life and it's horribly tragic.
Yes, Kat, that's a fair point, but what I'd say to that is this "It's okay to mob the store and hurt people to get cheap stuff" mentality has been building for YEARS.
I'm sure you've seen the crazed brides that get set loose in the bridal store and grab 10 dresses, shove people, etc., on the news. BRIDES? Oh yeah, if I were a groom and saw my bride on the news doing that I wouldn't hesitate to call that wedding OFF. If your woman (or man) is willing to SHOVE PEOPLE to save a few hundred bucks, you're going to have a long life.
Why can't the stores just see that things have gone wrong here, that our current mentality is 'crazed shopper' for many folks and just either not offer the Xbox for twenty cents or just shut the store down that day? And the thing is, it's not the stores' fault, and the stores employ people, and those people need to make money....
I don't know where the answer lies, Kat (or anybody else), but I do know it makes me sick to think that my son will grow up in a world where it is apparently OKAY to shove Grandma around if she has a bargain in her hand that you want. Oh, because it's BLACK FRIDAY. And that electronic item Grandma is holding is tipping out of her hand anyway...
If you've ever seen that cheesy "Ten Commandments" movie with Charlton Heston, it's like when he (Moses) comes down from getting the carved tablets from God and he sees everybody worshiping and dancing around the golden calf. That's what it starts to appear like.
I can assure you there is NOTHING that I nor any of my people need on Black Friday that I would shove someone for it.
And I was in Target yesterday (Terrific Tuesday perhaps?) and it was about 3 pm. I happened to be the only person entering the store right then, I didn't shove myself. I didn't try to take the doors off the hinges. I just walked right in, picked up my items, went to pay, chatted nicely with the cashier, and on my way out I just keep looking at that doorjamb and thinking "I can't believe crazed people would wreck this FOR BARGAINS."
Honestly, those tramplers should be banned from shopping or something. Yeah, this year it was one life lost, next year are we okay with two? What if that person is one of YOUR people? Your brother takes a temp job? Your mom is in the crowd and she falls over? What if your person doesn't die but sustains a bad injury? Hey, Happy Holidays to you -- now let's change your colostomy bag! (But everybody else got their plasma TV for 45 bucks so it's okay.)
Who should have to pay the price for your greed?
(And by your I don't mean YOU, Kat.)
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 11:24:58 AM
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KatMack
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I don't want to excuse their behavior IN THE LEAST. Please understand that I'm not trying to downplay the horror of what happened at all or to defend this type of behavior.
I've just been troubled by the comments such as "I can't believe I have to breathe the same air as these people" and the like. (Sorry, no time to pull the exact quotes). Yes, it is horrible, but even those that trampled and broke down doors and pushed and shoved are lost souls in need of the Savior- desperately in need of the Savior. Instead of decrying how wretched they are, we need to look at how empty their lives must be to be this desperate for physical possessions. I don't want us to lose sight of the fact that this is merely a byproduct of man's sinful nature and a reminder to all of us to be spreading the Gospel as far and as wide and as deep as we can. Jesus truly is the only answer to things like this.
--Kat
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 11:42:55 AM
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TwinCityGirl
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quote:
ORIGINAL: KatMack
I've just been troubled by the comments such as "I can't believe I have to breathe the same air as these people" and the like. (Sorry, no time to pull the exact quotes). Yes, it is horrible, but even those that trampled and broke down doors and pushed and shoved are lost souls in need of the Savior- desperately in need of the Savior. Instead of decrying how wretched they are, we need to look at how empty their lives must be to be this desperate for physical possessions. I don't want us to lose sight of the fact that this is merely a byproduct of man's sinful nature and a reminder to all of us to be spreading the Gospel as far and as wide and as deep as we can. Jesus truly is the only answer to things like this.
Well, of course, Kat, and every Christian woman here knows that. Knows EXACTLY what you just wrote: they all need Jesus, and people who really know Jesus don't disregard lives like that.
But in the short-term it does give one great pause, no, to think "I have to LIVE WITH PEOPLE for whom MY LIFE and MY CHILD'S LIFE *do not matter*."
And while I'm not a scared kind of person, that does concern me....to share space with such "Hey, out of my way! I matter and you don't!" kind of people. It does concern me because what if that doesn't happen on a Black Friday (when I'm not shopping anyway) but if there's a fire alarm accidentally pulled in the store while I'm in there and I am trampled on the way out as others save themselves?
So yes, you're fair to point out the "Okay, don't be so dramatic, they just need Jesus and it's not everybody that's shoving people" -- yes, fair and true -- but as Christians we don't have to sit back and think "Well, if they only had Jesus it would be all better, now wouldn't it?" and not go down the rabbit trail of WHAT IS HAPPENING IN THIS WORLD that people allow themselves to be part of such a horrible incident?
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 11:58:00 AM
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lexie
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Something is still upsetting me about the pregnant lady who was trampled. I feel awful for the woman (did she suffer a miscarriage, I'm hearing conflicting reports), however I cannot understand for the life of me what would make her line up knowing what the crowds can be like when she is 8 months pregnant. I've contemplated lining up before (but haven't) but there is no way I would do that at any time in a pregnancy. The health of my baby is far more important to me than a cheap dvd player.
And even if she didn't anticipate a trampling mob, I still can't see why she would place herself anywhere need it. If the crowd was that large, I would have kept away from it and waited until it died down, then go on. When I was 7 months pregnant I was working downtown and I was scared to take the subway at peak hours for fear someone would knock into me.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 12:57:59 PM
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spitzu
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Only it's not just one store out of thousands. It's hundreds of stores all across the country. Sure, someone didn't die in all of them, but I've heard reports of people getting punched, things stolen out of carts, being shoved. Not just in that one store.
It happens in my city, and we're not a huge city.
It's a mentality that is very widespread. It's not an isolated event.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:18:48 PM
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myka
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And there are plenty of Christians who participate in things like this...
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:21:03 PM
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RamiRedeemed
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participating in black friday shopping isnt against the bible lol
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Others talk because they have to say something.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:28:29 PM
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RamiRedeemed
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I see it as a sport. The violence that takes place on black friday at walmart is no worse than what takes place in a pro football game or in hockey. People who shop know the risks of it. Those who participate do it for the thrill of it, for the rush. And it's a lot of fun.
_____________________________
Some people talk because they have something to say.
Others talk because they have to say something.
-------------------------------
ramireconciled.blogspot.com
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:31:13 PM
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Roberta_
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RamiRedeemed
I see it as a sport. The violence that takes place on black friday at walmart is no worse than what takes place in a pro football game or in hockey. People who shop know the risks of it. Those who participate do it for the thrill of it, for the rush. And it's a lot of fun.
It's been 2 or 3 years since I've been to a live hockey game. Last one I went to didn't have any seniors or toddlers in the rink.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:31:33 PM
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lexie
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That's a very sad commentary on what our world is like Rami. It wasn't always like this. And I don't think the worker who lost his life, or the people who were punched in the face found it to be a sport or fun.
Comparing violence at Walmart on Black Friday to pro football makes absolutely no sense to me. Violence should never be expected in our society.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:34:13 PM
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RamiRedeemed
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Isn't violence what makes people watch pro wrestling? I'm not saying its right but those who go know that stuf like this happens every year. It's dangerous. If you don't want to get hurt then don't shop til saturday. it's very simple.
_____________________________
Some people talk because they have something to say.
Others talk because they have to say something.
-------------------------------
ramireconciled.blogspot.com
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:37:14 PM
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lexie
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From: Toronto
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So you are saying that those of who appreciate being civilised and acting in a courteous manner towards others should give up on getting our shopping done so that the people who want to maim, trample and kill can do so? Makes no sense to me, and that's a very scary world if we allow it to happen.
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I want to be more than an ordinary servant.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:43:03 PM
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Roberta_
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Rami- Every time someone gets hurt, you pay for it because the retailer will pass the costs on to the consumers.
I don't like crowds, so I don't go on Black Friday. In fact, I do very little shopping between Thanksgiving and mid-January because of the crowds. However, going to a store should never be dangerous. We have a very strong mentality of just pushing people out of our way or running them over to get what we want or to get to where we want to go. Society as a whole is becoming so self-centered that when we see someone fall we trample them (or kick them) instead of helping them.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:43:27 PM
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Miss Giggles
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Hate to break it to you but wrestling is fake.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 12/3/2008 1:46:29 PM
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Mrs.Wifey
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Miss Giggles
Hate to break it to you but wrestling is fake.
But boxing isn't, and it's pretty serious damage that can be done... Men have definitely been killed in the boxing ring.
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RE: Kicka - #4 - 
Mart are not generally well accepted by Christians.
)
That really does make sense to me no matter how stupid it may sound. We went boxing day shopping once. It was busy, but not scary or pushy at all. If it was we would have never went to the mall. And we went at 1pm... 4 hours after the mall opened. I would never put myself in a position where I could be harmed.