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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/26/2008 9:18:06 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
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quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
You know that's hogwash, for all you know any one of those agencies could have a file on you.
...
So, you think they would do a background check on my son and not the next potential President, yeah right. Exactly, how would they be influencing the election if they did their background check before either Presidential candidate announced their bid for office?
...
I'm not a Obama supporter for one thing. I just call things as I see them. This country use to be well respected, but with people like you promoting fear and paranoia I wonder if it ever will be again.
I know for a fact that the FBI and Secret Service have files on me. I covered the White House nd have done work for the Justice Department. But, I doubt very seriously that either the NSA or the CIA have indepth files, who are precluded except in very, very rare instances from keeping files on U.S. Citizens. The CIA might have a small file simply because I have been on campus in the past and right out of high school applied for work there. But, beyond those direct contacts, they would have nothing since they are precluded from having them.
And, yes, the president is a special situation and if you can find one single confirmation that ANY of these agencies vet a presidential candidate, then I will shut up on the subject. I am not a bit concerned that you will find any evidence that they do.
WE THE PEOPLE, are supposed to vet the president. If we want a person with a radical left background then that is what we will get.
I'll wait for you to find your confirmation that Obama has been vetted in ANY way by ANY of the agencies you mentioned and I look forward to your reply... if you can.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Questioning Obama's citizenship Part II - 10/26/2008 9:24:03 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
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There are legitimate reasons for needing to know if, in fact, Obama was born in Hawaii and not just registered in Hawaii. There is the little issue of the fact that one of only threee requirements for president is that they must be natural born.
You know, in that pesky old little piece of paper called the Constitution.
quote:
ORIGINAL: luvmy3kids
quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
DNC steps ion to silence Lawsuit over Obama birth certificate
The above link takes you to a discussion on www.FreeRepublic.com about Obama's citizenship.
Seems a Pennsylvania democrat has been trying to get a copy of Obama's birth certificate (or get proof that Obama was born in the US or it's territories) for a while. He finally filed a lawsuit alleging that Obama is not a natural born citizen and is thus not eligible to be President.
This has been going on for months. Finally the DNC has stepped in and filed a motion to dismiss the suit.
Lots of good discussion on FreeRepublic (which is why I posted the link). One point that makes a lot of sense to me is "if Obama has a certificate, why doesn't he just show it and prove he's a citizen. The way the situation is being handled leads one to belive that he does not have a certificate and iis thus not eligible OR he is totally inept at handling little things like this (which come to think of it, would make him ineligible in a different way)"
SERIOUSLY? Why would anyone doubt he is NOT a citizen? Because he had a choice that his father was from Kenya? My father is from Rochelle GA but I don't claim to be a GA Peach (not that I'm putting GA Peaches down I'm not) but why on earth should he have to prove he is american citizen. Don't you think when he first ran for president since it's one of the coniditons to be safe all candiates have to prove that?
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/26/2008 9:25:17 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
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What? Facts scare you?
quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
Beg, pardon, but Bush used drugs and is a re-covering alcoholic. There probably are very few people who haven't used or tried drugs at least once in their lifetimes.
Actually, that just bolsters my point that there is no law enforcement or other government agency vetting of candidates. As I said in another post, I looked into what it takes to run for President. Granted it was not an exhaustive investigation, but aside from finding no requirement to prove Constitutional qualifications, there was also no mention whatsoever of having to pass any sort of background checks. Zero.
It is typically the media that digs into every nook and cranny of candidates' backgrounds and puts the information out there for all to see whether or not the people trust the candidate enough to vote for him/her. However this time they have decided to turn a blind eye to Obama's past and are not doing their job. So, we have an apparently completely un-vetted candidate about to be elected to the Presidency. Wonderful.
quote:
Can you tell me how deep his association with Ayers really goes? Have they conspired to overthrow the government together? I am sure all of his associations have been looked into.
And I am doubtful that is the case. I do not know the full extent of Obama's relationship with Ayers, but they have worked together extensively on various boards, appeared in public together, Obama endorsed his book, launched his political career in Ayers' home, and lied about his relationship to minimize the connection. That's an awful lot to simply dismiss.
It may be the Secret Service has done some research on Senator Obama, but their goal would be to identify possible threats to him or his family in order to properly protect him. It would seem to me that would be a very different sort of background check than for a security clearance.
-Robb
ok I'm done here. You go right on believing your conspiracy theories.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/26/2008 9:28:41 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
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Like you, I have tried to find ANYTHING that would validate the idea that a presidential candidate is vetted for eligibility before they can run.
The ONLY vetting, beyond our vote, that seems possible is if ONE Senator and ONE Congressman raise the question of eligibility on the day that the election is to be validated and certified. I'm not sure we even have anyone in the house or senate that cares all that much about the Constitution and right.
quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
ok I'm done here. You go right on believing your conspiracy theories.
You contended that candidates must go through rigorous background checks by government agencies. I found no supporting evidence for this in the requirements to run for President. I also related my personal experience with the security clearance process and contrasted it with what is publicly known about Obama. How is any of that a conspiracy theory?
-Robb
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/26/2008 11:01:44 PM
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His_4_Ever
Posts: 599
Joined: 10/4/2008
From: Idaho
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
What? Facts scare you?
Not as much as truth scares you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 12:34:17 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
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Campbe33,
Have you ever heard the term "Due Diligence"? If one should be responsible for making sure that they are done their Due Diligence in buying or evaluating a business , then shouldn't we be lauded instead of vilified for simply making sure that we have done Due Diligence when it comes to a presidential candidate?
The fact that you see no need for Due Diligence in your own evaulation is not only sad; but, it is exactly the kind of attitude that demogogues count on.
Due Diligence is all ABOUT finding TRUTH... not running from it.
quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
What? Facts scare you?
Not as much as truth scares you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 12:59:01 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Ouch!!!!!!!  The lawsuit was dismissed because Berg could not show any real interest other than not liking the candidate. Had an opponent filed suit, then one could argue a potential personal loss should Obama win.
And the supposed audio tape sounds questionable. Berg is waiting on a translation. Then how does he know what it says?
This is what makes it tough to really be convinced that Obama supporters are critical thinkers or at the very least, pay attention to detail.
Both of your statements are inaccurate at best and complete distortions at worst.
The technical term was that the judge found that ordinary citizens, like Berg, lacked 'standing' to file a lawsuit demanding proof of a presidential candidate's qualifications. In other words, you, I and every other non-elite out there is simply a pawn with no control of our own destinies whatsoever when it comes to the Constitution. You fail to fully understand what a devastating blow that is to freedom.
Would you not suffer a los if a deceptive person wins the presidency when they duped you into thinking they WERE eligible? I think so. But, the judge did not.
And, what Berg has said is not that he he has not already heard a translation of the tape; but, that he is waiting for CERTIFIED translation of the tape which he will need for legal purposes.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 1:10:32 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3970
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
Ouch!!!!!!! The lawsuit was dismissed because Berg could not show any real interest other than not liking the candidate. Had an opponent filed suit, then one could argue a potential personal loss should Obama win.
And the supposed audio tape sounds questionable. Berg is waiting on a translation. Then how does he know what it says?
This is what makes it tough to really be convinced that Obama supporters are critical thinkers or at the very least, pay attention to detail.
Both of your statements are inaccurate at best and complete distortions at worst.
The technical term was that the judge found that ordinary citizens, like Berg, lacked 'standing' to file a lawsuit demanding proof of a presidential candidate's qualifications. In other words, you, I and every other non-elite out there is simply a pawn with no control of our own destinies whatsoever when it comes to the Constitution. You fail to fully understand what a devastating blow that is to freedom.
Would you not suffer a los if a deceptive person wins the presidency when they duped you into thinking they WERE eligible? I think so. But, the judge did not.
And, what Berg has said is not that he he has not already heard a translation of the tape; but, that he is waiting for CERTIFIED translation of the tape which he will need for legal purposes.
We know more about these two candidates than any in history. Why isn't the GOP bringing the suit. Well, McCain must be in on it, too.  That means that the whole system is corrupt, so we non-elitists don't have a chance, anyway. This "standing" thing is not anything new. Do you want anybody with a beef to be able to tie up a candidate with lawsuits?
And why do the people that would have standing not bring suit?
And, the accuser has the burden of proof in our system, something you don't grasp.
_____________________________
Nobody ever heard of Acid Rain before we sent people into space.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 2:44:02 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
And, the accuser has the burden of proof in our system, something you don't grasp.
You see, this is exactly why we are in the mess we are in. People do NOT understand the law at all.
Criminal PROSECUTION is quite different from ELEGIBILITY. They are legal polar opposites when it comes to burden of proof.
When people cannot see that when it comes to eligibility the burden of proof is on the one trying to attain a position, then we are, indeed, ripe for tyranny and lawlessness.
He's not being ACCUSED of running for president, he's VOLUNTARILY running for president. And, the very fact that the Constitution has specifically specified the eligibility requirements and he continues to run is a defacto admission on his part that he should meet those requirements.
The problem, obviously, is that the liberals have attained their goals when it comes to education. Now, nobody seems to know anything about the Constitution and the rule of law.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 3:55:05 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3970
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
The problem, obviously, is that the liberals have attained their goals when it comes to education. Now, nobody seems to know anything about the Constitution and the rule of law.
I was referring to the court case. In court the accuser (Berg) had the burden of proof. Now, I do agree that there is surprisingly little "proving" of eligibility in the Presidential process. Since the conduct of elections is conrolled by the states, each candidate must get on the ballot in each state, which is why third-party candidates do not often get on all ballots.
Therefore, even if a question was raised, it would have to be done in each state. It is a bit late to go this route.
But, if there were shenanigans about his birth certificate, it would seem that somebody inside the conspiracy would have ponied up something worth pursuing. This "secret" would be worth too much money and notariety to go unleaked.
_____________________________
Nobody ever heard of Acid Rain before we sent people into space.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 3:58:46 PM
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HighPlainsDrifter
Posts: 1304
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: The Great Sioux Empire
Status: offline
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And...Hillary would have found and used it. Guaranteed.
_____________________________
Give a hoot, eat yer Lute, Der's no risk in Lutefisk.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 4:04:19 PM
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clout
Posts: 139
Joined: 1/23/2008
Status: offline
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As an Independent voting for years for the lesser of two evils, we need to lighten up. 1) God is in control, 2) the Muslims have attacked us several times over the past several years, 3) on national TV Obama has declared his muslim beliefs, 4) what would be better than to have a muslim president in office to negotiate with the muslims?
_____________________________
Melvin Klaudt
Colossians 16:b, "teaching and admonishing one another in Psalms, hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord".
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 4:44:16 PM
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davemiller7
Posts: 1085
Joined: 3/5/2008
From: NC via NY
Status: offline
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I had an extensive investigation run on me prior to obtaining a top secret / crypto clearance for the now defunct US Army Security Agency. They interviewed people from my past and (at that time) present. I think every detail of my life was uncovered. I doubt very seriously that Obama could have received even those clearances back then. Yet we're going to trust him with the presidency?
quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
I have been interviewed by DoD personnel who were investigating former students for the purpose of obtaining security clearances. Based on the questions they asked and what is public knowledge about Obama, I have real doubts he would pass such an investigation.
I googled some on this topic but couldn't come up with anything more credible than blogs either way.
-Robb
_____________________________
-Dave
The Prayer of Protection
The light of God surrounds me,
The love of God enfolds me,
The power of God protects me,
The presence of God watches over me.
Wherever I am, God is.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 5:04:49 PM
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His_4_Ever
Posts: 599
Joined: 10/4/2008
From: Idaho
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: davemiller7
I had an extensive investigation run on me prior to obtaining a top secret / crypto clearance for the now defunct US Army Security Agency. They interviewed people from my past and (at that time) present. I think every detail of my life was uncovered. I doubt very seriously that Obama could have received even those clearances back then. Yet we're going to trust him with the presidency?
quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
I have been interviewed by DoD personnel who were investigating former students for the purpose of obtaining security clearances. Based on the questions they asked and what is public knowledge about Obama, I have real doubts he would pass such an investigation.
I googled some on this topic but couldn't come up with anything more credible than blogs either way.
-Robb
How do you know that, you're just assuming he wouldn't pass. Like I said before any background check would probably be considered
"classified". I am sure they didn't make the information in your background check public knowledge.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 5:23:26 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
But, if there were shenanigans about his birth certificate, it would seem that somebody inside the conspiracy would have ponied up something worth pursuing. This "secret" would be worth too much money and notariety to go unleaked.
quote:
ORIGINAL: HighPlainsDrifter
And...Hillary would have found and used it. Guaranteed.
Actually, One Senator and One House member could force the issue if he is elected. But, they have to do it on Jan 6, the day the election is certified.
But, the problem with relying on ANYBODY to turn up PROOF that he is not natural-born, like Hillary or McCain, is that they know that the stall could be a trap. Should they demand evidence, with so many people already believing the non-evidence, and it turned out in his favor, they could really be hurt by the process. And, since only HE is in control of the evidence, they can't know if it's a setup or not.
You see, the ONLY possible person that actually LEGALLY KNOWS is Obama. The computer kicked out the request without any human actually looking in the file. I'm guessing that it's even illegal to look at the original even if you are an employee of the Vital Statistics without a specific approved reason for doing so. So, he has it all locked up from a legal standpoint until a judge says otherwise. He's holding all the cards.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 5:24:40 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
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This isn't about Muslim. It's about natural-born. The Constitution makes NO eligibility requirement based on religion... only birth.
quote:
ORIGINAL: clout
As an Independent voting for years for the lesser of two evils, we need to lighten up. 1) God is in control, 2) the Muslims have attacked us several times over the past several years, 3) on national TV Obama has declared his muslim beliefs, 4) what would be better than to have a muslim president in office to negotiate with the muslims?
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/27/2008 5:31:31 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1936
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
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Here again, a president does not have to be cleared. If the American people are stupid enough to trust their lives with a man that could betray them, then so be it. This is not about clearance, although I understand your point. It's about one of three qualifications for holding the office of the president. And, two out of three just isn't good enough.
But, let's see what the great orator and defender of the Constitution Robert Byrd does when it's push come to shove. I'll bet the old pompass fraud will fold like a broken kite. He's a disgrace to the great Byrd family name as far as I'm concerned.
quote:
ORIGINAL: davemiller7
I had an extensive investigation run on me prior to obtaining a top secret / crypto clearance for the now defunct US Army Security Agency. They interviewed people from my past and (at that time) present. I think every detail of my life was uncovered. I doubt very seriously that Obama could have received even those clearances back then. Yet we're going to trust him with the presidency?
quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
I have been interviewed by DoD personnel who were investigating former students for the purpose of obtaining security clearances. Based on the questions they asked and what is public knowledge about Obama, I have real doubts he would pass such an investigation.
I googled some on this topic but couldn't come up with anything more credible than blogs either way.
-Robb
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/28/2008 10:59:44 PM
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ManimalX
Posts: 1271
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
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I was a bit shocked today that Mike Rosen, a long time Colorado radio personality, spent all three hours of his radio program discussing the 0bama birth certificate issue. I say this was shocking because Rosen HATES conspiracy theory. He is extremely fiscal conservative but socially much more libertarian. He can be quite cantankerous and doesn't put up with people avoiding direct answers.
Anyway, he spent all 3 hours on this issue and had as guests Constitutional scholar Bruce Fein, reporter Ken Timmerman, and Judge Andrew Napolitano.
The entire dialogue was VERY informative on the Constitution, even if it doesn't sound like there is much of a chance of 0bama's lack of a birth certificate going anywhere, the speculation is that he doesn't produce it because it has something politically ugly on it like a religious declaration.
Anyone interested in learning a lot about the Constitution and the Presidential selection process should listen to the October 28th show:
http://www.850koa.com/pages/mikerosen.html
The show is presented with commercial breaks edited out.
_____________________________
"But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." - 2nd Peter 3:10
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RE: OBAMA'S GRANDMA CONFIRMS KENYAN BIRTH! - 10/28/2008 11:06:17 PM
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luvmy3kids
Posts: 150
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cow451
quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
The problem, obviously, is that the liberals have attained their goals when it comes to education. Now, nobody seems to know anything about the Constitution and the rule of law.
I was referring to the court case. In court the accuser (Berg) had the burden of proof. Now, I do agree that there is surprisingly little "proving" of eligibility in the Presidential process. Since the conduct of elections is conrolled by the states, each candidate must get on the ballot in each state, which is why third-party candidates do not often get on all ballots.
Therefore, even if a question was raised, it would have to be done in each state. It is a bit late to go this route.
But, if there were shenanigans about his birth certificate, it would seem that somebody inside the conspiracy would have ponied up something worth pursuing. This "secret" would be worth too much money and notariety to go unleaked.
Exactly!
_____________________________
Luvmy3Kids
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