|
Users viewing this topic:
none
|
|
Login  | |
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:01:45 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
You cannot deny correctly that the Bible says to treat animals humanely.
I've never seen anywhere that I am suppose to treat an animal like I treat a human.
Now, that is not what I wrote, is it.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:04:39 PM
|
|
|
1love1God1way
Posts: 2478
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
|
Well, that's how I would define treating something humanely (humanly).
_____________________________
love.ben
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:04:57 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
Jhud, I know that I will forget that this "conversation" ever happened. . . .
Let me be clear. . . .
I am sorry, Jhud, but what you think doesn't matter. Bullfighting is not in line with what the Bible teaches about how to treat animals. That ought to be your bottom line, but apparently, in this subject, it is not.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:06:27 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
Well, that's how I would define treating something humanely (humanly).
Not according to the dictionary.
Quote:
1. Characterized by kindness, mercy, or compassion: a humane judge.
2. Marked by an emphasis on humanistic values and concerns: a humane education.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:11:15 PM
|
|
|
Jhud
Posts: 7627
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: offline
|
quote:
I am sorry, Jhud, but what you think doesn't matter. Bullfighting is not in line with what the Bible teaches about how to treat animals. That ought to be your bottom line, but apparently, in this subject, it is not.
Well, no, the Bible does not teach against 'bullfighting', and we should not pretend that it does.
If it did, I would be glad to condemn it, but we should not add to Scripture things that are not clearly there.
_____________________________
Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:11:25 PM
|
|
|
solo_soprano22
Posts: 2431
Joined: 4/27/2005
From: I'm a Southern girl
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
You cannot deny correctly that the Bible says to treat animals humanely.
I've never seen anywhere that I am suppose to treat an animal like I treat a human.
Humane doesn't mean just "humanly." It has meanings beyond what humans do or act toward each other. I believe it's one of those words with several meanings.
_____________________________
For God, For Learning, Forever.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:16:52 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
Well, no one has ever called me a humanist 
Again, someone is confusing the issue, and this time, it is you. To act humanely cannot be automatically discounted just because humanists also believe in the same principle. Humanists do a lot of things you do; are you going to quit doing them because humanists do them?
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:18:27 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
I am sorry, Jhud, but what you think doesn't matter. Bullfighting is not in line with what the Bible teaches about how to treat animals. That ought to be your bottom line, but apparently, in this subject, it is not.
Well, no, the Bible does not teach against 'bullfighting', and we should not pretend that it does.
If it did, I would be glad to condemn it, but we should not add to Scripture things that are not clearly there.
The Bible is clear about how to kill an animal and what purposes are legitimate. Read it.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:22:32 PM
|
|
|
Jhud
Posts: 7627
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: offline
|
quote:
The Bible is clear about how to kill an animal and what purposes are legitimate. Read it.
I have been reading it for more than twenty years, thank you very much, and it doesn't say an animal can't die by a spear or sword, any more than it can't die from a bullet.
_____________________________
Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 7:38:50 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
I know that you have been reading the Bible, and that is what has endeared you to me -- the very fact that you respect it in every case that I have seen you answer -- until today!
- The Bible is clear about why a beast may be killed.
- The Bible is clear about what beasts may be killed for food
- The Bible is clear about what must be done to kill a beast for food.
Obviously, one may kill that animal in order to sustain life or to keep from being wounded, and in that case, the life of the human comes first; therefore, the one who is going to kill the animal does whatever they must in order to sustain life. That would be perfectly biblical. But going into the ring in order to harrass a bull is not included, nor is sticking it with instruments until it falls down dead from being mercilessly wounded over and over.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 8:40:24 PM
|
|
|
1love1God1way
Posts: 2478
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline
|
And how dare Samson and David kill lions with their bear hands!
_____________________________
love.ben
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 9:11:29 PM
|
|
|
His_4_Ever
Posts: 599
Joined: 10/4/2008
From: Idaho
Status: offline
|
I hate see the meaningless torture of any animal. When I was stationed in Okinawa there was a Bullfighting ring right down the road from family housing. I could always hear the people cheering and could not help but feel for those poor animals.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 9:53:37 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
And how dare Samson and David kill lions with their bear hands!
I have reading problems, but apparently, you do, too, if this is in answer to any of my posts. We can each pray for the other, that we will improve in our reading skills! 
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 10:10:48 PM
|
|
|
solo_soprano22
Posts: 2431
Joined: 4/27/2005
From: I'm a Southern girl
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: campbe33
I hate see the meaningless torture of any animal. When I was stationed in Okinawa there was a Bullfighting ring right down the road from family housing. I could always hear the people cheering and could not help but feel for those poor animals.
I didn't realize until recently that bullfighting exists in Japan.... but it does. I don't mind it so much as long as there are no lances and swords. Really... if one is so valiant and courageous, why the need for banderillos anyway? Wouldn't it be more courageous to face the unmaimed bull? I guess that's just me. Then afterwards the bull can just go off somewhere, to be killed humanely for food or something else.
_____________________________
For God, For Learning, Forever.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 10:13:10 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
bare hands.
*hangs head in shame*
I've been making more grammatical errors in the last week . . .
Edit: So many grammatical errors that I had to edit this short post twice.
You would not believe how many times I redo my poses, and I still have errors. We're human.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 11:30:05 PM
|
|
|
Child4Jesus
Posts: 467
Joined: 5/24/2005
From: Long Island, Nassau, Elmont, NY
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
quote:
Jhud, I know that I will forget that this "conversation" ever happened. . . .
Let me be clear. . . .
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
I am sorry, Jhud, but what you think doesn't matter. Bullfighting is not in line with what the Bible teaches about how to treat animals. That ought to be your bottom line, but apparently, in this subject, it is not.
Please enlighten me as to what you are talking about as to how humans are to treat animals. What does the Bible say? All I have seen is instructions Israel what animals to eat and not eat, not to have sex with animals, and so forth.
_____________________________
In Christ,
Richad
The greatest heresy to American Christianity is that if you ask Jesus to come into your heart, he definitely will.
Paul Washer
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/23/2008 11:37:31 PM
|
|
|
Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
Status: offline
|
Well, please forgive me, but I am at work, and if I were home, I am not sure I would answer your question. I get so frustrated that people don't read the whole of the Bible, that they don't take 75% of it seriously (yes, I sat down earlier this week and added it up), and that they continue to carry around those big books when they could just downsize to Matthew through Revelation, minus a few Scriptures within those, and have the whole of what they believe.
It is time for believers to start reading the Bible for themselves and stop asking for the easy answers, stop asking to be spoon-fed, learn what it says for themselves. Jhud didn't ask your question because Jhud knows what the Bible says.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/24/2008 12:08:27 AM
|
|
|
Jhud
Posts: 7627
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
Status: offline
|
quote:
I didn't realize until recently that bullfighting exists in Japan.... but it does. I don't mind it so much as long as there are no lances and swords. Really... if one is so valiant and courageous, why the need for banderillos anyway? Wouldn't it be more courageous to face the unmaimed bull? I guess that's just me. Then afterwards the bull can just go off somewhere, to be killed humanely for food or something else.
Bulls are armed with big pointy horns, which they use quite effectively. Doing so with out a pointy instrument in one's hands would truly be inhumane, to the Matador.
_____________________________
Jack
I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
- C.S. Lewis
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/24/2008 12:22:35 AM
|
|
|
Child4Jesus
Posts: 467
Joined: 5/24/2005
From: Long Island, Nassau, Elmont, NY
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Well, please forgive me, but I am at work, and if I were home, I am not sure I would answer your question. I get so frustrated that people don't read the whole of the Bible, that they don't take 75% of it seriously (yes, I sat down earlier this week and added it up), and that they continue to carry around those big books when they could just downsize to Matthew through Revelation, minus a few Scriptures within those, and have the whole of what they believe.
It is time for believers to start reading the Bible for themselves and stop asking for the easy answers, stop asking to be spoon-fed, learn what it says for themselves. Jhud didn't ask your question because Jhud knows what the Bible says.
Ok. Not sure where that came from. I have read more than just Matthew to Revelation. I have read the entire Bible. However I don't memorize every little detail. There are things that affect how I live as a Christian and how animals are to be slaughtered is not one of them. No place in scripture does it say not to kill animals with swords, spears, clubs, etc. I have never come across any scripture that says, You have to slaughter _________ animal in ___________ way. If you don't the land will vomit you out.
Also I'm 100% sure that God doesn't expect us to slaughter an animal in the fashion that He instructed Jews to. It doesn't have to be a whole ritualistic thing. Much of the animal slaughter had to do with some sort of offering to God. Then they had to use some for food. And only certain people could eat it.
People forget that animals were created for man. We are to care for them yes. But lets not pretend they are equal with humans. They are our food, pets, load bearers, etc. You better believe if a dog was trying to kill me I will shoot it dead. However I'm not going to tie up a dog just to torture it. That is completely wrong. I also don't believe that people should have dog fights, Rooster Fights, or any sort of fights pitting animals against each other. Bullfighting is different for the reasons Jhud stated and the bull is used for food once the fight is over. The body isn't just thrown away. I'm sure it isn't like that 100% of the time however.
One thing that has to be said. Just because you and some in the post have a conviction about Bullfighting doesn't mean we all have to have that same conviction.
_____________________________
In Christ,
Richad
The greatest heresy to American Christianity is that if you ask Jesus to come into your heart, he definitely will.
Paul Washer
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/24/2008 12:23:21 AM
|
|
|
PaleHawkWoman
Posts: 645
Joined: 7/14/2005
Status: offline
|
I grew up on a farm, and we have always raised animals to butcher for meat. They graze or scratch as God intended, are caredfor and watched over, and killed as quickly and humanely as possible.
I also hunt and fish- most of us country folks and Native folks do. I use a bow because I really don't like shooting guns(I can use a rifle or pistol with more than proficient accuracy). I have a 48# recurve bow, use standard aluminum shafted hunting arrows with 2-blade broadheads for squirrel, rabbit, and other small game, 4-blade broadheads for deer. I do not use a tree-stand or lures, I stalk. In essence, I am trying to track and sneak up close to an animal with senses far keener than mine and nail it with one shot to bring it down quickly. Some days I am successful, many days I am not. Of course, the squirrels are pretty easy pickings as they are not very smart, and most rabbits will freeze thinking you don't see them. Groundhogs are more cautious than squirrels, and generally don't wander too far from their holes. Deer, however, have very keen senses, hide during the day, and move very fast. Hitting one on the fly with an arrow is not easy at all, and with a recurve I have to get much closer than with a compound bow or rifle. I have a CaneBrake Long Hunter, which has a fast release and airspeed, but you always have to calculate for windspeed, distance, and gravity when taking aim, as well as how fast and which direction the prey will move upon hearing the twang of the bow as it snaps back. I get 1-2 deer a season myself, but can bag 8-10 squirrels or a brace of rabbits in an afternoon.
I do not take killing anything as sport or entertainment of any kind. That animal belongs to God, not me, and I both ask His permission and apologize for taking the life of one of His creatures. Every part of the game taken is used, and used with gratitude. We hunt to eat- plain, pure, and simple- and take no more than we need. I do not go after "trophy" bucks as their meat is way too gamy and tough. I go after 2-3 yrs old bucks and dry does so that the meat is good for eating.
I consider bullfighting, dog fighting, and other blood sports- including boxing- to be gross and inhumane, and at odds with God's intention for how His creatures are to be treated.
|
|
|
|
|
RE: Bullfighting - 10/24/2008 12:28:12 AM
|
|
|
Child4Jesus
Posts: 467
Joined: 5/24/2005
From: Long Island, Nassau, Elmont, NY
Status: offline
|
In Bullfighting they try to sever the spine for a quick death. In hunting from what I have seen it is the head or heart for a quick death.
_____________________________
In Christ,
Richad
The greatest heresy to American Christianity is that if you ask Jesus to come into your heart, he definitely will.
Paul Washer
|
|
|
|
 New Messages |
 No New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/ New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/o New Messages |
 Locked w/ New Messages |
 Locked w/o New Messages |
|
 Post New Thread
Reply to Message
Post New Poll
Submit Vote
Delete My Own Post
Delete My Own Thread
Rate Posts |
|
|
Forum Tools
Printable Version
