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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/1/2008 10:17:46 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 11092
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Consecrated2God
quote:
ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
By all means - make it your own! But instead of crossing your arms, sitting down in disgust because how "dare" the pastor ask you to do such a silly task, and getting annoyed . . . Kristin, I'm a little confused. Where in this thread has anyone indicated that is what they do?
Yeah, I've never seen anyone say they do that, either. I know I don't. I usually do what the pastor tells me, even though I've often wondered what the point is exactly.
Oy. All through this people have complained about "fakes" and how stupid this is and it makes them mad and blah, blah, blah and this is evidence of how unloving the church is and how dare pastors "force" people to greet each other, and how they hate greeting people, etc, etc. I guess from all that, my mental image is of folks doing exactly what I described - maybe not physically, but at least internally.
I'm not sure why what I'm saying is so darn controversial. I'm simply trying to encourage folks to use this as an opportunity and not gripe about it. Maybe I'm being more insistant than I should be, but I'm completely flabborgasted why this simple thing upsets people. Good grief! Of all the things to get upset about in the world, we're upset when the pastor says to tell your neighbor a corny greeting? 
I guess I'm not getting my point across very well, so maybe I need to bow out of this conversation. 
_____________________________
~Kristin~
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/1/2008 11:50:17 PM
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hoppersfan
Posts: 793
Joined: 6/27/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
quote:
ORIGINAL: Consecrated2God
quote:
ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
By all means - make it your own! But instead of crossing your arms, sitting down in disgust because how "dare" the pastor ask you to do such a silly task, and getting annoyed . . . Kristin, I'm a little confused. Where in this thread has anyone indicated that is what they do?
Yeah, I've never seen anyone say they do that, either. I know I don't. I usually do what the pastor tells me, even though I've often wondered what the point is exactly.
Oy. All through this people have complained about "fakes" and how stupid this is and it makes them mad and blah, blah, blah and this is evidence of how unloving the church is and how dare pastors "force" people to greet each other, and how they hate greeting people, etc, etc. I guess from all that, my mental image is of folks doing exactly what I described - maybe not physically, but at least internally.
I'm not sure why what I'm saying is so darn controversial. I'm simply trying to encourage folks to use this as an opportunity and not gripe about it. Maybe I'm being more insistant than I should be, but I'm completely flabborgasted why this simple thing upsets people. Good grief! Of all the things to get upset about in the world, we're upset when the pastor says to tell your neighbor a corny greeting?
I guess I'm not getting my point across very well, so maybe I need to bow out of this conversation.
Well, I don't think anyone is "upset" about it the way you seem to imply. I personally think that being directed to say something to someone else during church is cheesy at best. It seems very insincere to do that at the nudging of another person. My point is, I would hope "greetings" would come from the heart, and not because you had to do it because you were told to. The fact that we don't agree doesn't mean that I feel animosity toward you. When you mentioned people crossing their arms and sitting down in disgust, I just didn't take that as a fair depiction of what is being said here. I don't do that, and I have never seen anyone do that, even if they were uncomfortable.
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 12:34:36 AM
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Szaftoo
Posts: 795
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: So. Calif.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: WhiteRoseBlessings
Carolyn, I've read many of your threads throughout the years; none of them have ever appeared to be judgmental.
Thank you, that was very kind.
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 1:14:25 AM
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pstrdebi
Posts: 739
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From: So. Oregon, by way of So. Cal.
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Some people like steak... some people like chicken... some people don't eat meat at all.
Is it all worth debating so strongly?
Does it all really matter in the whole scheme of things?
We have to remember that our congregations are made up of multiple personalities. There are introverts and extroverts... there are Popular Sanguines, Powerful Choleric's, Perfect Melancholy's and Peaceful Phlegmatic's. We cannot expect everyone to be the way we want them to be or expect them to be or hope for them to be.
We also need to remember that there are those who have been deeply hurt in the past... by others and by people in the church, and there are those who do not have a care in the world and they love everyone they make eye contact with. And of course the multitude of personalities and individual situations that are the make-up of everyone in-between.
Let each one be as they wish to be.... and each one grow at their own speed. We're not all alike (Thank God!)
And just to note: I thought the OP was talking about when the pastor say's something like, "Turn to you neighbor and tell them, you are an overcomer" In and of itself, that statement is a good, true statement. But it does feel uncomfortable at times to do that.
Greeting the people in the church is a different thing alltogether. It's a good time to reach out and welcome others, especially visitors. (And even though germs and the cold season freak me out a little) I still do it.
But, again... to each his own.
_____________________________
"For in Him we live and move and have our being..." Acts 17:28a
http://www.therockfellowship.org
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 2:04:30 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 11092
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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OK, just to defend myself - this is WHY I have the image in my head that I do of what I posted. These are little quotes from throughout this thread regarding this greeting time:
"Hate it"
"Would not go to a church that did this"
"Refused to participate"
"Fake and annoying"
"Leave during the greeting time"
"Escape"
"Never get up to greet people"
"Vegas hypnotist show"
"Silly and no value"
"Quota"
"Contrived & insincere"
"Forced relationships"
"Insensitive"
"Produces a false sense of community and relationship"
"Pretending to care for someone"
Am I like the only person here who doesn't find that rather extreme? I'm not saying everyone here is saying that so maybe folks are feeling that I'm attacking them when I'm not. But there does seem to be some rather negative attitudes towards something while it may not be your style is such a small thing IMHO. I don't get it. There are many things that aren't my style and I wouldn't say the above about it.
The only points I'm trying to make, and apparently doing a very poor job of it, are trying to encourage folks, if you church does this, to find a way to use this as an opportunity and take advantage of it - in whatever way best fits your style but still gets to you step outside yourself. If you're already doing that - HALLELUJAH! That's awesome! If you aren't, may I encourage you to try?
_____________________________
~Kristin~
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 3:21:33 PM
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Roberta_
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Kristin- I wouldn't say that I find it any of that. I just don't understand why it's done during service and not before or after church is over?
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 7:01:35 PM
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pstrdebi
Posts: 739
Joined: 4/28/2008
From: So. Oregon, by way of So. Cal.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
OK, just to defend myself - this is WHY I have the image in my head that I do of what I posted. These are little quotes from throughout this thread regarding this greeting time:
"Hate it"
"Would not go to a church that did this"
"Refused to participate"
"Fake and annoying"
"Leave during the greeting time"
"Escape"
"Never get up to greet people"
"Vegas hypnotist show"
"Silly and no value"
"Quota"
"Contrived & insincere"
"Forced relationships"
"Insensitive"
"Produces a false sense of community and relationship"
"Pretending to care for someone"
Am I like the only person here who doesn't find that rather extreme? I'm not saying everyone here is saying that so maybe folks are feeling that I'm attacking them when I'm not. But there does seem to be some rather negative attitudes towards something while it may not be your style is such a small thing IMHO. I don't get it. There are many things that aren't my style and I wouldn't say the above about it.
The only points I'm trying to make, and apparently doing a very poor job of it, are trying to encourage folks, if you church does this, to find a way to use this as an opportunity and take advantage of it - in whatever way best fits your style but still gets to you step outside yourself. If you're already doing that - HALLELUJAH! That's awesome! If you aren't, may I encourage you to try?
You cannot make people enjoy something... or "get behind it"... if their heart is not in it. And I think that is where these folks (the ones you are mentioning) are at with this. Like I said... maybe they have been hurt by someone before and they just stuggle with the whole intamacy thing or getting close to folks. That takes time for some people to get used to or get into. You can't force it on folks and if there are churches out there that do or put them down for it... then shame on them. They will make friends in their own time and in their own way.
Like I said... some like steak... some like chicken, etc.
WE NEED TO CELEBRATE EACH OTHERS DIFFERENCES!! And not try to get everyone to be cookie-cutter Christians. Just love them for who THEY are in Christ.
_____________________________
"For in Him we live and move and have our being..." Acts 17:28a
http://www.therockfellowship.org
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 8:18:18 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 11092
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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quote:
ORIGINAL: pstrdebi
You cannot make people enjoy something... or "get behind it"... if their heart is not in it. And I think that is where these folks (the ones you are mentioning) are at with this. Like I said... maybe they have been hurt by someone before and they just stuggle with the whole intamacy thing or getting close to folks. That takes time for some people to get used to or get into. You can't force it on folks and if there are churches out there that do or put them down for it... then shame on them. They will make friends in their own time and in their own way.
Ummm. Where did anyone say we should "make people enjoy something"? All I'm trying to encourage folks to do is to look beyond themselves and use an opportunity given them, even if they think the opportunity is corny or stupid, for the glory of the Lord. Since when is that a bad thing? I don't go to church to have someone pat me on the hand and say "Do what you feel comfortable with and don't stretch yourself". I go to church to be personally challenged in my faith and grow. Is that not what we are all called to? To encourage and build up?
quote:
Like I said... some like steak... some like chicken, etc.
WE NEED TO CELEBRATE EACH OTHERS DIFFERENCES!! And not try to get everyone to be cookie-cutter Christians. Just love them for who THEY are in Christ.
I'm not trying to be difficult, but huh? How in the world is encouraging folks to greet each other (again, this is straight from the NT) forcing everyone to be cookie cutter Christians? If you think I'm someone who tries to make "cookie cutter Christians", you really don't know me. In fact, I'd say you're not celebrating who I am in Christ - an exhorter - someone who wants to see us step out and grow and not being afraid to be the one to have folks mad at me for doing so. 
The fact is, as others have posted (even those of you who think I'm being so mean ), the church should love and reach out to folks. We shouldn't stay in our "we four and no more pews" and stay focused on me-myself&I. What kind of church would that be? Oh wait! That would be a horrid church that the same folks complaining about greetings are complaining about being fake.
I've not said I think we must have a silly greeting time in a service. I'm not saying, we all have to have coffee and cookies after service. I'm not even saying, there is a certain phrase we are "supposed" to say. What I AM saying is that no matter what your body of believers does, use every opportunity you are given for the glory of the Lord. If that's a corny greeting? Don't be offended - find a way to use it in your own special way. If that's passing out bulletins and saying hello as folks walk into the service? Don't be upset - find a way to use it in your own special way. If that's making a follow-up call for someone you haven't seen in a long time? Don't whine about it - find a way to use it in your own special way.
Ephesians 5:16 making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil.
_____________________________
~Kristin~
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 9:44:53 PM
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pstrdebi
Posts: 739
Joined: 4/28/2008
From: So. Oregon, by way of So. Cal.
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
quote:
ORIGINAL: pstrdebi
You cannot make people enjoy something... or "get behind it"... if their heart is not in it. And I think that is where these folks (the ones you are mentioning) are at with this. Like I said... maybe they have been hurt by someone before and they just stuggle with the whole intamacy thing or getting close to folks. That takes time for some people to get used to or get into. You can't force it on folks and if there are churches out there that do or put them down for it... then shame on them. They will make friends in their own time and in their own way.
Ummm. Where did anyone say we should "make people enjoy something"? All I'm trying to encourage folks to do is to look beyond themselves and use an opportunity given them, even if they think the opportunity is corny or stupid, for the glory of the Lord. Since when is that a bad thing? I don't go to church to have someone pat me on the hand and say "Do what you feel comfortable with and don't stretch yourself". I go to church to be personally challenged in my faith and grow. Is that not what we are all called to? To encourage and build up?
quote:
Like I said... some like steak... some like chicken, etc.
WE NEED TO CELEBRATE EACH OTHERS DIFFERENCES!! And not try to get everyone to be cookie-cutter Christians. Just love them for who THEY are in Christ.
I'm not trying to be difficult, but huh? How in the world is encouraging folks to greet each other (again, this is straight from the NT) forcing everyone to be cookie cutter Christians? If you think I'm someone who tries to make "cookie cutter Christians", you really don't know me. In fact, I'd say you're not celebrating who I am in Christ - an exhorter - someone who wants to see us step out and grow and not being afraid to be the one to have folks mad at me for doing so.
The fact is, as others have posted (even those of you who think I'm being so mean ), the church should love and reach out to folks. We shouldn't stay in our "we four and no more pews" and stay focused on me-myself&I. What kind of church would that be? Oh wait! That would be a horrid church that the same folks complaining about greetings are complaining about being fake.
I've not said I think we must have a silly greeting time in a service. I'm not saying, we all have to have coffee and cookies after service. I'm not even saying, there is a certain phrase we are "supposed" to say. What I AM saying is that no matter what your body of believers does, use every opportunity you are given for the glory of the Lord. If that's a corny greeting? Don't be offended - find a way to use it in your own special way. If that's passing out bulletins and saying hello as folks walk into the service? Don't be upset - find a way to use it in your own special way. If that's making a follow-up call for someone you haven't seen in a long time? Don't whine about it - find a way to use it in your own special way.
Ephesians 5:16 making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil.
_____________________________
"For in Him we live and move and have our being..." Acts 17:28a
http://www.therockfellowship.org
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/2/2008 10:54:19 PM
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buckifn
Posts: 1863
Joined: 5/23/2006
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if you are doing it only because someone else told you to...and not motivated from love...kindness...genuine hospitality..then yes, imo...you are being a hypocrite. However, I am not judging anyone's heart..which is why I said "IF"...nobody really knows that but you and God...but my point is why would I need anyone to tell me from the pulpit to do that. I should be doing that all week long.
In the time spent going around the church doing this I know for a fact there are some who only say crude hurtful rude things and NOT genuine caring things so it's best eliminated imo.
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/3/2008 10:31:21 AM
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phosadaud
Posts: 11092
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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Thanks. Contrary to what folks thinks, I'm not bothered when folks disagree with me - in fact, it's makes for good discussion. Yes, I am passionate when I debate, but that's what I want - Challenge my points! Let me challenge yours! Iron sharpens iron! This is one of the ways I learn!
So, as much as I find this an interesting thread, I won't keep posting if I'm really upsetting folks. That's not my goal, but apparently I'm not doing a good job of expressing myself. So, if you want a different perspective, just let me know and I'll come back. Otherwise, I apologize for not expressing myself well and I'll see you all around the boards.
(and so my tone is not misunderstood, I am not angry - just a bit sad and discouraged)
_____________________________
~Kristin~
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/3/2008 5:45:24 PM
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Lady_of_Faith
Posts: 81
Joined: 9/18/2008
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Yesterday, I don't know, maybe because it was communion Sunday, but our pastor had us 'turn to your neighbor' too many times, even the lady sitting next to me gave me a strange look.
My brother asked our pastor why he does this and his explanation was it gets the congregation to act more friendly.....
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/3/2008 8:26:08 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 11092
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
Status: offline
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Ah. Here I thought when folks were responding to my posts and asking questions, it meant they wanted to discuss it. Little did I know that meant they actually wanted me to shut up. And when I didn't get that oh-so-obvious hint, folks figured rather than just say something, they would post the oh-so-loving rolling eye smace and make me wonder even more what was going on.
Got it.
Unsubscribing.
_____________________________
~Kristin~
Classified Ads: "Government employer looking for candidates. Criminal background required."
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/3/2008 11:21:40 PM
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pstrdebi
Posts: 739
Joined: 4/28/2008
From: So. Oregon, by way of So. Cal.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: phosadaud
Ah. Here I thought when folks were responding to my posts and asking questions, it meant they wanted to discuss it. Little did I know that meant they actually wanted me to shut up. And when I didn't get that oh-so-obvious hint, folks figured rather than just say something, they would post the oh-so-loving rolling eye smace and make me wonder even more what was going on.
Got it.
Unsubscribing.
Kristen...
Read 1 Corinthians 9:20-22
Paul was to others what he needed to be in order to win them. If there is someone in church who absolutely abhors greeting time... should we continue to get in their face every week being bouncy and obnoxious? Or should we become, like Paul, adaptable to them in order that they are wooed by our gentleness?
Just some food for thought.
(edited because I apparently had trouble spelling last night)
< Message edited by pstrdebi -- 11/4/2008 9:26:23 AM >
_____________________________
"For in Him we live and move and have our being..." Acts 17:28a
http://www.therockfellowship.org
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RE: "Turn to the person on your right and say...&q... - 11/4/2008 8:48:12 AM
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Consecrated2God
Posts: 5140
Joined: 4/4/2005
From: Formerly Jesus Land
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Everyone is welcome to share their opinion here. I don't think there are tons of people who are angry and upset about this practice--if there were, there would be mutiny in the churches each time a pastor asked this and the pastors would probably drop it. I don't think most pastors even realize that a lot of people don't care for it, because most people just grin and bear it.
But this is a discussion, and everyone's welcome to share their opinion. Just because someone hates that time and wishes they could escape doesn't mean they are angry or bitter or something is terribly wrong with them. I don't think anyone is wrong to not it.
And yes, pstrdebi, I was talking about things like you mentioned: ("You are an overcomer".) I'm talking about anytime the pastor tells us to turn to our neighbor and say something specific, whether it's in the greeting time or during the sermon or at any other time during the service. I'm not talking about general greet-your-neighbor times.
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Bonky
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Um, I'm not upset. I do have a fairly blunt posting style, so maybe folks are misunderstanding my tone and therefore misunderstanding what I'm saying (which I admit to being frustrated about because I get frustrated when I can't seem to communicate my thoughts in a manner in which folks understand and I'm very much feeling that in this thread).
All this time I thought this was a discussion forum....
